Avengers Endgame

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takenoko
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Avengers Endgame

Post by takenoko » Sat May 04, 2019 6:31 pm

Who wants to bet on how long it takes Toei to do a fast follow on Endgame? I'm thinking we're going to start seeing echoes of it in the winter Rider movie this year.
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Loved depressed Thor. I've seen some people complain that it sucks that Thor becomes a bunch of fat jokes, but I love it because A: It subverts Thor as being this impossible man god, and B: the scene with his mom is really good!

When Cap runs into the office in the past. I pointed so the guy next to me could see that I was pointing at a -ter on the office door before it expanded to show Margaret Carter. It felt appropriately sad, but a bit truncated, so it was pretty cool to see that it was leading somewhere at the end.

Best thing: Bruce Banner uses science to give the Hulk nearsightedness.

I can't believe they got Natalie Portman to come back for this.

Can't wait to see how they deal with all the time travel stuff.
Worst part was we sat in front of a little kid. I swear there was 5 minutes where the parents fell asleep and forgot to shush the kid, who would keep talking throughout the movie.

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Re: Avengers Endgame

Post by Catastrophe » Sun May 05, 2019 4:18 am

I had annoying kids behind me with a parent that didn't do shit. I should've gone to a more out of the way theater because I didn't have this issue with infinity war.
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My only gripe with the whole move was that I feel like the ending fight was too short. They could have benefited from a long tracking shot like the first avengers show casing all the characters over a couple of minutes. I also thought that shot with all the females heroes was a little cringe, if only for the fact it wasn't organic. Kind of wish Hulk did more fighting as well (and more Avengers got rematches against the Children of Thanos from the last movie, like Strange beating Maw as opposed to holding the Hudson back the whole fight).

Fat Thor was fine. It's not like they were fat shaming him. He was legit depressed and had let himself go because he realised it was primarily his fault Thanos won and killing him at the start of the movie didn't do anything for him. Besides, they needed to nerf him in some way so he didn't crush past Thanos that didn't have any stones.

Character dynamics were great. I would have never thought Rhodey and Nebula would work off each other. Scott and Steve/Tony was fun as well.

The throw backs to the previous movies were great. I loved when T'challa gets the gauntlet from Clint and refers to him by name (Civil War) and Steve picks up Thors Hammer (Ultron).
Overall, it was a great conclusion to the Marvel Saga to date. If you had told me in the span of 11 years Marvel would release 22 movies and most of them would be really good with an epic 2 part conclusion, I would have laughed at you. They'll obvious press on and keep these movies going, but I just don't see anything topping Endgame for them.

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Re: Avengers Endgame

Post by takenoko » Sun May 05, 2019 5:40 am

I think we can do away with spoiler tags at this point of the thread. If you've come this far, you should either watch the movie or be okay with spoilers.

>I also thought that shot with all the females heroes was a little cringe, if only for the fact it wasn't organic.

Yeah, I think the sentiment is good, but it felt very on the nose what they were trying to do. Also, someone pointed this out on a podcast I'm listening to, the characters are all mostly background or support characters, so it's not a great showing considering the main lady rep for this series got offed in the first half of the movie.

Also, I spent the longest time figuring out who the Iron Maiden was supposed to be. Feels like there was a cut scene where they were supposed to have introduced that. I mean, the helmet doesn't even look like the one the daughter finds.

>Character dynamics were great. I would have never thought Rhodey and Nebula would work off each other.

But if they ended up on the mountain of contrived plot devices, who would end up getting thrown off? I mean, yay for cyborgs!

But yeah, great sendoff to the movie series. I don't remember if I mentioned in my first post, but I just thought Infinity War was okay. That was a solid B movie, but this one gets an A. Despite any flaws, it's pretty smart with the callbacks and the payoff to a lot of stuff set up over many many movies.

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Re: Avengers Endgame

Post by Mxylv » Sun May 12, 2019 3:53 pm

Gonna go with a spoiler-free version first off.

First of all, Endgame feels like a thank you to the entire fans for sticking around with the MCU, so the more you've seen the more you'll appreciate (which isn't to say that is solely comprised of Marvel fanservice, although a couple of sequences may fit that description). Its juggling act of an massive cast felt a little less seamless than Infinity War's, though it managed to throw a surprising and impressive amount of character development into a movie that would normally beg to be straight-up action (a fact I appreciate after I felt the Hobbit trilogy's The Battle of Five Armies held too much action at the expense of anything else). There's still some levity, though the circumstances restrain it more than one may be used to from prior MCU entries--a fact that oddly makes Infinity War feel superior as a comedy despite its disastrous ending.

The movie certainly still had a few issues. Probably my least favorite part of the movie is a character's personal arc basically amounting to "give up growing as a person." I mean, one shouldn't beat oneself up about not being perfect and I could see the anti-depression theme it pointed to upon hearing that the directors said so, but this moral kinda defeats not only the point of the character's previous development but also that of superhero movies in general. Beyond that, however, the movie was a pretty satisfying conclusion to the Avengers saga, and while I'm thankful I don't have to feel obligated to keep following the story around, it was quite an fun ride. On our way back from the theater, one family member was noting that providing a satisfactory ending to such an extensive film saga was almost more impressive than having such an impressive saga in the first place, and I'd definitely agree with the sentiment.


And with that, here's the more spoilery version:
--The Good--
Okay, wow. If someone randomly told me that Endgame had Spider-Man swinging on Thor's flying hammer while holding an infinity gauntlet before landing on a pegasus, I probably would've thought it was a joke. Seriously, the final arc looked like the directors wanted to throw everything fans could want at the screen (short of having the TV SHIELD team or the Defenders onscreen, though I'm thankful for the human Jarvis' cameo) that could possibly involve the characters we know. The payoff was fantastic, the action somehow outdid Infinity War's battle, Captain Marvel was much more intelligently integrated into the final fight than Superman was in Justice League's finale IMO, and the ending felt clever enough to justify Doctor Strange's oddly specific 14,000,605 to 1 success ratio.

Also, I'm really looking forward to Anthony Mackie getting more screen time and showing up in more extras. He's really a joy to watch behind the scenes.

--The Bad--
The advice given to Thor. I mean, is it any surprise that out of the two kids Odin and Frigga raise, one of them starts his character arc acting like a jerk and the other is Loki? In fact, why does Frigga tell Thor to eat a salad if eating a salad is something the Thor he should be would do? I can see the moral that people shouldn't condemn themselves for their failures, but it feels like an editor should have caught the advice itself as a plothole for previous Thor movies that relied on character growth; this doesn't ruin the movie for me, though it still feels disappointing. On a separate note, Thanos is fantastic in his first few minutes of screen time, but 2014 Thanos feels rather bland compared to his Infinity War personality.

--The Ugly--
There were a few inconsistencies here and there throughout the film. A lot of small things can show up, like character (most notably Hulk and Captain America) appearing in updated armor in the final act when there seemed to be no reason to change armor. Also, a rat getting Scott out of the quantum realm could conceivably happen, though it also felt like a bit of a deus ex machina.
takenoko wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 5:40 am
>I also thought that shot with all the females heroes was a little cringe, if only for the fact it wasn't organic.

Yeah, I think the sentiment is good, but it felt very on the nose what they were trying to do. Also, someone pointed this out on a podcast I'm listening to, the characters are all mostly background or support characters, so it's not a great showing considering the main lady rep for this series got offed in the first half of the movie.
Yeah, having a "Look, we're feminist" moment doesn't work for me when, out of the two female time travelers, one dies and the other gets captured. Perhaps it was meant as an apology, one may hope?
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Re: Avengers Endgame

Post by takenoko » Sun May 12, 2019 4:48 pm

>I mean, one shouldn't beat oneself up about not being perfect and I could see the anti-depression theme it pointed to upon hearing that the directors said so, but this moral kinda defeats not only the point of the character's previous development but also that of superhero movies in general.

Yeah, Thor does seem to suffer from relearning the moral in every movie he's in. But in fairness, I'll blame it on how they had to reboot his character for Thor Ragnarok.

>On our way back from the theater, one family member was noting that providing a satisfactory ending to such an extensive film saga was almost more impressive than having such an impressive saga in the first place, and I'd definitely agree with the sentiment.

It's pretty nice

===And with that, here's the more spoilery version: ===

> the ending felt clever enough to justify Doctor Strange's oddly specific 14,000,605 to 1 success ratio.

That seems like a lot of tries to arrive on "I have to save Ironman so he can sacrifice himself 5 years later."

>There were a few inconsistencies here and there throughout the film. A lot of small things can show up, like character (most notably Hulk and Captain America) appearing in updated armor in the final act when there seemed to be no reason to change armor.

Huh, I didn't notice that

>Also, a rat getting Scott out of the quantum realm could conceivably happen, though it also felt like a bit of a deus ex machina.

The 14,000,605 was because the rat didn't get Scott out those other times.

>Yyyyeah, having a "Look, we're feminist" moment doesn't work for me when, out of the two female time travelers, one dies and the other gets captured. Perhaps it was meant as an apology, one may hope?

Yeah. I mean, I feel like it sucks either way. I want them to do something for the females, and this is sorta a nice step. But at the same time, 22 movies and Captain Marvel is the only one to star a woman, and that came out a few months ago. So it's like taking the "We do right by ladies award" without really earning it.

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Re: Avengers Endgame

Post by Catastrophe » Mon May 13, 2019 3:22 am

Captain Marvel herself doesn't really work in the movie anyway. I guess it was because they shot her scenes in the movie before her own movie, but I don't really get her character because I don't think the actress has any idea what her character is supposed to be either.

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