KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by OOOKaiser »

Shunpei was the most useless side character I ever seen.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by Lunagel »

He had moments. Few and veeeeeeeeeeeeeery far between, but they were there.

I hate to say it, but most useless side character is probably Smart Lady. Could have replaced her with a small dog in a skimpy blue costume and I don't think you'd have to change any dialogue.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by takenoko »

Yeah, Shunpei can be annoying, but he's at least somewhat defensible.

Aww, but Smart Lady was fun and had a lot of silly moments. Also, Kurihara Hitomi is awesome.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by dancercotillion »

Shunpei would have been fixed in many ways by rolling him into Beast. Keep his origin in the show the same; he's a dork who wants to be a magician, is tricked into despair by a Phantom, and Haruto saves him by killing the Phantom inside him. But now, Shunpei can never be a magician! Oh noes ;___;

So he starts to research how to be a magician anyway, and chases the leads until he finds the Beast Belt and becomes a magician just like he wanted. And then that's like a clue towards what Wiseman is later in the show.

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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by DrowningFishy »

Karoum wrote:
Plot hole:

Why did White Wizard bother giving the driver to Haruto in the first place? When you think about it it's pretty stupid. He needed mages, not mages with active drivers. Also, the more mages with drivers you have running around, the less phantom you have available to do your bidding and the slower the process of creating mages. He could've given Haruto the driver and the please ring and left his daughter with him for her energy needs.
Forgive me for bringing this up. There is a perfectly good reason the White Wizard bothered giving Haruto the driver. He needed someone to be the energizer bunny. You know how much energy toys take to keep running?
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by Mandalori »

I think they ask why he gave him the power to fight. He could have just tell him that he's now the only one who can keep Koyomi alive, without telling him that he could fight against Phantoms that he's using to make more Mages to bring back to life his precious daughter.

Unless he wanted him to be her bodyguard.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by TNT »

Wizard to me is the rider series that could, but didn't.
As others have said there was plenty of potential, but none of it was ever properly utilised. Poor pasing also didn't help.

Whatever happened to dragon preying on Haruto?

I think that a lot of the problems came from what they were trying to do with Fueki. Unfortunately it was handled so badly that everyone knew after 10 episodes that WM was WW. It was so Obvious that I felt that it had to be a decoy, they couldn't possibly be thinking this wasn't going to come up flat.....and then they did. It was flatter than my bike tire.
Strangely I don't know how they could've fixed it.

Phantoms didn't seem threatening, storyline wise this makes sense. WM didn't care about phantoms and what I liked was how this was becoming more apparent as the show progressed. Unfortunately this removed any sense of suspense.
I think the threat of the Phantoms would've been infinitely better if they had only had at least one guy/girl lose to despair.

I loved Beast but at the same time I felt that he was the absolute worst/weakest secondary ride rI had ever seen. He made me feel like Den-o Platform could've kicked his ass. How many Phantoms did he kill/eat? Like 4? His upgrade was invalidated pretty much the episode after getting it.
Storylinewise there are justifications, from being a primordial mage to not being trained like Haruto but still. He never goto better at his powers.
He isn't the first secondary rider who was clearly weaker (Birth) but he is the first where it became annoying.
At least he had an epic end.

Overall it felt like the show shoulve ended after Fueki bit the dust, Sora didn't add much afterwards.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by [kuronogantzryu] »

TNT wrote:Whatever happened to dragon preying on Haruto?
If I remember correctly, Haruto faced the Phantom (Dragon) inside him and proved that he could control him. At that point, Dragon pretty much gave up on trying to take over Haruto, even though he does keep on saying that he'll take him over.
TNT wrote:I loved Beast but at the same time I felt that he was the absolute worst/weakest secondary rider I had ever seen. He made me feel like Den-o Platform could've kicked his ass. How many Phantoms did he kill/eat? Like 4? His upgrade was invalidated pretty much the episode after getting it.
He's not that weak. He's more of a gag Rider. Having various forms and lucking out (with the dice rolls), his final attacks are quite deadly. As for the Phantoms, he killed most of them after his debut and almost all the useless Ghouls in each arc.
TNT wrote:Overall it felt like the show shoulve ended after Fueki bit the dust, Sora didn't add much afterwards.
Yeah. It seemed like they didn't wanna kill his character off that EP and decided to add a pointless arc resolving his motives and the series but ending the series after Fueki died would've tanked the show even further IMO. At least the ending that aired concluded the series on a better note.
---
dancercotillion wrote:Shunpei would have been fixed in many ways by rolling him into Beast. Keep his origin in the show the same; he's a dork who wants to be a magician, is tricked into despair by a Phantom, and Haruto saves him by killing the Phantom inside him. But now, Shunpei can never be a magician! Oh noes ;___;

So he starts to research how to be a magician anyway, and chases the leads until he finds the Beast Belt and becomes a magician just like he wanted.
Although it's kinda Ryuki-ish, that would've been a better change for the series.

When the show first started, I expected the trio of Haruto / Koyomi, Shunpei and Rinko to fulfill their story / character arcs by the end of the series. Unfortunately, as the series progressed, the latter duo only became minor-supporting characters with little to no characterization.

With your idea, at least Shunpei could've achieved his hope of becoming a Wizard and with the finale, at least Rinko moved up the police force and fulfilled her hope of becoming a great person like her father. Only gripe is that it's not that significant since she wasn't really the focus of the series until she was relevant.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by TNT »

[kuronogantzryu] wrote:
TNT wrote:Whatever happened to dragon preying on Haruto?
If I remember correctly, Haruto faced the Phantom (Dragon) inside him and proved that he could control him. At that point, Dragon pretty much gave up on trying to take over Haruto, even though he does keep on saying that he'll take him over.
So they dropped it. :( And there wasn't even much made of it to begin with.
TNT wrote:I loved Beast but at the same time I felt that he was the absolute worst/weakest secondary rider I had ever seen. He made me feel like Den-o Platform could've kicked his ass. How many Phantoms did he kill/eat? Like 4? His upgrade was invalidated pretty much the episode after getting it.
He's not that weak. He's more of a gag Rider. Having various forms and lucking out (with the dice rolls), his final attacks are quite deadly. As for the Phantoms, he killed most of them after his debut and almost all the useless Ghouls in each arc.
Most Riders don't kill things before debut. :P
I think he lucked out on his weapon rolls twice. Neither time was enough to kill the Phantom. The dice thing was just there to give him an excuse for not killing the enemy. Unfortunately the only time he ever had a good roll was against enemies that could tank the hits, making him look silly, weak and useless.
Your defense of Beasts power includes the words "he killed almost all of the useless Ghouls"
Yes, the useless Ghouls that were thwarted by the mighty Shunpei and his traffic cone. Also Haruto regularly beat them up without even changing. :P
Beast was the weakest and most useless secondary rider I have ever seen. I am just happy he had an epic final fight. He deserved better for the potential that was there.
TNT wrote:Overall it felt like the show should've ended after Fueki bit the dust, Sora didn't add much afterwards.
Yeah. It seemed like they didn't wanna kill his character off that EP and decided to add a pointless arc resolving his motives and the series but ending the series after Fueki died would've tanked the show even further IMO. At least the ending that aired concluded the series on a better note.
I'm curious what you mean by this. How would it have tanked the show even further? :?:

[kuronogantzryu] wrote:
dancercotillion wrote:Shunpei would have been fixed in many ways by rolling him into Beast. Keep his origin in the show the same; he's a dork who wants to be a magician, is tricked into despair by a Phantom, and Haruto saves him by killing the Phantom inside him. But now, Shunpei can never be a magician! Oh noes ;___;

So he starts to research how to be a magician anyway, and chases the leads until he finds the Beast Belt and becomes a magician just like he wanted.
Although it's kinda Ryuki-ish, that would've been a better change for the series.

When the show first started, I expected the trio of Haruto / Koyomi, Shunpei and Rinko to fulfill their story / character arcs by the end of the series. Unfortunately, as the series progressed, the latter duo only became minor-supporting characters with little to no characterization.

With your idea, at least Shunpei could've achieved his hope of becoming a Wizard and with the finale, at least Rinko moved up the police force and fulfilled her hope of becoming a great person like her father. Only gripe is that it's not that significant since she wasn't really the focus of the series until she was relevant.
This would've made the show a lot better as well.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by [kuronogantzryu] »

TNT wrote:I'm curious what you mean by this. How would it have tanked the show even further? :?:
For me, Wizard started off great by introducing characters that could be disposable but ended up being supporting characters. Like I said, I always thought it was gonna be a trio series with Haruto / Koyomi, Rinko and Shunpei resolving their respective stories by the end of the series. I didn't know what Haruto or Koyomi's goals were in the beginning but I knew Rinko wanted to be a respectable policewoman and live up to her father's reputation while Shunpei wanted to be a mage and help others. It's obvious that these characterization details weren't really touched upon until the story needed them again nor were the characters, so that's one of the reasons I'm disappointed with this show.

Another reason is that the series blatantly seemed to be an amalgamation of other Rider series. It started off as its own unique story but one aspect or theme from a series would pop up, then another and another, and eventually it just ended up being a muddled mess. The series tries to be too much and as a result pushes too much on me, as a viewer, to actually care about the situations or characters brought up. I pretty much gradually stopped caring or liking the show after Phoenix was killed.

If the show had ended after Fueki died, both my points would've been further proven that the series isn't good: It doesn't take the time to address characters or situations until they are relevant to the plot. When they do, I've already lost interest by that point or it's just not handled well.

It's a shame that Wizard started off great too.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by Kaiehc »

The series as a whole felt really weak to me, but really only because I thought the W, OOO, and Fourze were strong and really solid shows. I felt like Wizard's characters just weren't given enough love by the show's writers. A lot of character arcs and plot points were wrapped up using the easiest and laziest methods from a writer's point of a view, and knowing who was in charge of Wizard's production I'm not surprised at all. Wizard's supporting characters can't hold a candle to W's supporting cast or the Kamen Rider Club. Rinko should have been the strong, kick ass character that they hinted at in Ultimatum and towards the end of the series, but they just played her off as slapstick comic relief for most of the series.

Another thing that really set Wizard apart from its last 3 predecessors was its villains. W, OOO, and Fourze had incredible villains that were pretty deep and multifaceted for a kid's show. They were interesting and great to watch, in some cases they really stole the scenes away from the protagonists. With the exception of Koyomi's dad, Wizard's villains were incredibly flat and boring. In many cases I felt like Medusa, Phoenix and Gremlin were just really cheap Greed knockoffs.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by squashy »

It just suddenly dawned in me that White Mage is similar to a Kamen Rider, that's why they never let him play the role of the final villain. Yep, nailed it.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by TAKBonez »

Overall I really liked the series, I thought it was cool, dark, and gritty the way people were turned into kaijins this season. After reading the forums though and thinking about it, I think it could have been way better if some of the gates had turned into phantoms after the sabbath. Haruto had it too easy, he was also kind of a douche at the beginning especially towards Beast. I mean come on man, kick the Phantoms ass but at least let Beast eat it. Gremlin is my fucking hero! Just an all around fun villain he's batshit crazy, a psychopath, sneaky, is always scheming and king of trolls.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by OOOKaiser »

TAKBonez wrote:Overall I really liked the series, I thought it was cool, dark, and gritty the way people were turned into kaijins this season.
I don't think the phantoms ever succeeded in making a gate fall to despair. Except for that guy who cried over his bird.
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Re: KR Wizard Complete Series Discussion

Post by Dengar »

^Ahaha, I firmly believe that that guy died and gave birth to a phantom which was then unceremoniously killed off offscreen.
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