why is kamen rider changing tones?

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goshinki
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why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by goshinki »

Just wanted to know why kamen rider is veering away from it's darker tones. Not that its a bad thing, i just hope they make more shows like black, kuuga and 000. Enjoying fourze and gaim as well. Just seems that over the last few series the shows are veering away from the dark stuff.. not that i've seen every episode to justify this commentary :P

Maybe it's just me.

Well, that said i do enjoy this series, and sentai as well :) just kind of wondering what caused the change in gears over the last few series that was all :P

Thank you btw :) great work on maintaining this for so long. I have been visiting this site for close to 10 years now :)
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

Mostly a change in values, aiming to childrens who would buy the toys and avoiding parents complaining about what their childrens are watching, i think.

I call this the reverse Doctor Who effect. in that While doctor who started very kid friendly(which, for a series during the sixties WAS kid friendly), but slowly became darker and more mature as the years passed(BTW, no, the darker and mature aspects wasn't what led to the canellation of the original series, it was because one of the higher ups hated the show for reaons unrelated to its tone or its popularity)
Yet with kamen rider, it has become more and more lighter in each installment, maybe because that gave them better ratings, or made parents happier, i don't know.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by goshinki »

Ya, there definitely is a change in tone over the last 5 or so series.
Still great stuff though :)

thanks, the explanation was helpful :) and i am a Doctor who fan as well :P
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Dengar »

I'd like to mention that the current series is pretty dang dark.

Aside from that though, even in Japan, parents are worrying about what their kids are watching, and it takes writers with guts to challenge that. (Urobuchi clearly doesn't care much for moral guardians, plus he himself probably considers all this stuff "kid friendly" anyway)
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

i know, but i would argue that it is more of a special case rather than an attempt from the KR producers to try and make the show darker again. This may be the start of a more mature number of KR series or we could return to the more lighter series. We don't know yet.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Dengar »

Kamen Rider has never been "mature". Some have had "parental bonus" at best, but it remains at heart, a kids' show. A good one that does try to teach serious business to kids, don't get me wrong, but there is a very big difference between "mature" and "serious". Even with Urobuchi writing, it's still very "kiddy", although it's Urobuchi's personal brand of "kiddy". (Listen up, kids. Growing up isn't fun at all. There is no time for games or playing around, growing up is serious business, and if you're not ready for that, things will go very, very wrong)
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

Kuuga was very mature. But my point is, i don't believe Gaim would set the new standard as to how KR series are going to be from now on.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Catastrophe »

I disagree. Gaim is definitely shaping up nicely. The dancing is pretentious and seems child like, but we are only in 14 episodes in and it's already shaping up to be darker than the other post decade series.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

again, i feel Gaim will be the darkest Neo-heisei series yet, BUT that it will not be followed by "dark" KR series or will set what new series are going to be like. i believe it will stay, and i am not saying this in a negative way, as an odd entry in the neo-heisei series.
It will be dark, it may even be mature, but as of right now, i don't believe this is a sign that future KR series are going to be like this one.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by chcoman123 »

Catastrophe wrote: it's already shaping up to be darker than the other post decade series.
Most of the time, Neo Heisei series generally stay light and happy until the last ten episodes. Then everything goes to s***. *COUGH COUGH* DOUBLE *COUGH COUGH*
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

Not really, it's just that's the moment the plot finally arrives, but while dramatic, they aren't really that dark. Drama and plot twists in seasons finales do not equal Dark. by that logic, MLP would be a very dark series.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Catastrophe »

The drama comes from the fact that since W, we've had established villains for most of the show. In the endgame episodes, they all start dying, and you may or may not feel bad for them depending on how good the writing is. Gaim is already giving us despair based on the fact that some of the monsters killed are shown to have been people. Urobutcher promised that it would have a darker tone.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Dengar »

I still wouldn't call it "mature" though. My use of the word "kiddy" may have been a bit inappropreate, but I see various themes that kids of various ages understand at different levels. (refer to my earlier post for an example) Just because it's for kids doesn't mean it has to have giant grotesque baby-like TV aliens rolling down hills and all that.
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by Revorse »

Dengar wrote: grotesque baby-like TV aliens rolling down hills and all that.
lol. what a visual. won't be forgetting that anytime soon
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Re: why is kamen rider changing tones?

Post by locuas »

Dengar wrote:I still wouldn't call it "mature" though. My use of the word "kiddy" may have been a bit inappropreate, but I see various themes that kids of various ages understand at different levels. (refer to my earlier post for an example) Just because it's for kids doesn't mean it has to have giant grotesque baby-like TV aliens rolling down hills and all that.
Well, i generally consider shows that deal with things like Suicide as "mature", and Kuuga and Agito had plenty of themes that i don't consider for a kid's show but for a family show(for simplicity, i consider a family show a show that, among other things, would need an adult to help the children understand some of the things presented, that is my definition, if you believe the shows don't fit that particular definition, feel free to corect me)
Also, i don't think every children would understand the same way, i believe a 12 year old would get most of the things presented in Kuuga, but a 10 year old and below would need help, and that's not considering that all childrens are different from one another.
I consider Kuuga Mature because it has Mature themes like Suicide and death, which i do not consider something you would find in a kid's show. That being said, i consider a kid's show can approach a topic in a mature way. MLP is a fantastic example of this(BTW, I do not consider MLP a family show because i believe the themes presented in it can be understood by most childrens, even if it has a big adult demographic)

So, the series that I consider Family shows are:
*Kuuga
*Agito
*Ryuki
*Faiz
*Kabuto
*OOO(I am counting it mostly because of Maki and Ankh. most other stuff i think kids can understand just fine)

The series i consider Kid's shows are:
*Blade
*Kiva(which is also my favorite KR series, btw)
*Den-o
*W
*Fourze
*Wizard

I am not counting Hibiki because i feel it is the kind of series which will look different depending on the person
I am not counting decade because i really do not care for it.
I am not Counting Gaim because it is still too early to tell. but i am inclined to count it as a kids show because i think kids can understand the themes in the show.

I am 99% that something there will have a different meaning than i intended.
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