Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

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Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Lunagel » Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:32 am

Wiki: http://wiki.tvnihon.com/wiki/Drive_Saga ... ider_Heart

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I went into this fully expecting it to be a heartless, boring, irritating cash grab. I was... pleasantly surprised actually. The story's not the greatest, pretty predictable, but it had some actual drama and I laughed out loud at a couple points. Mach was a bit of a pain in the ass in the series and idk if it's just cause Ghost and Ex-Aid are not that great but I honestly felt he had improved from when I last saw him. I liked the talk with Kiriko (holy crap breastfeeding in KR that's a first) where it feels like the Riders are moving on with their lives and growing up.

So an unexpected 4/5 for me but minus one point for coming wayyyyy too after the series to give a crap and not including captions dammit Toei.

Also, I don't remember Rinna-san being quite so outlandish with the costumes in the series. What's up with that?

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Yaiba » Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:20 am

I love this movie.

The bad part is always the slapstick comedies, but they are short enough and out of the main story's way so I can totally ignore and forget about them.

Gen-san was a traditional no-good cop with a heart, even in the series he was just a going around doing errands while the others deal with the high-tech or political stuff. That's what makes the part where Heart learn what it meant to have a "heart" (pun intended) from him good. No other characters would have had the same impact. This part feels like a police drama with Kamen Rider added to it, if that makes any sense.

I'm glad they chose "family" as the main focus on Mach's story, because that's what has been bothering Go, Kiriko and Chase for a good part of the series. Go was an annoying brat in the series, but it really shows he has grown a lot in this movie. And I'm super glad they found a way to bring Chase back, even only as a ghost. He had learn the importance of family and had been protecting Kiriko and Go, and will continue to do so.

And one thing I like is that Shinnosuke appeared as a mentor-type figure. I never expect his to appear, but when he does, his presence is strong, but he doesn't steal the spotlight. This is his series, but this is not his movie.

This is a pretty good epilogue showing how everyone is moving on with their lives.

- I do not recognize Kiriko until she said she was married to Shinnosuke.
- Toei heard the fans' cries of that crappy Mach Chaser at the end of the series, because this Mach Chaser design is badass.
- Kamen Rider Heart's design is very cool too, with monster-y elements incorporated into the Rider suit.
- I didn't expect they'd make a new suit for Roidmude 005. At last he gets an evolve form after appearing and being a plot point for so many times now.
- The wheel that stuck in Drive's chest is a whole wheel and not just the tyre?! :P

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Go-On Macaroni » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:10 pm

Mach Saga kinda lost me when it became a worse version of Accel Returns; no ranting Akiko but I never cared about Gou so, worst of either world.
Heart's? I didn't really care for Rinna or Gen's antics any more than I did in the actual show so, that was a drag. And lol at Gou acting like he was Chaser's buddy after all the garbage he pulled about it during the show. Heart himself was okay, though. Btw, there's a point when Golden Heart and 5886 are fighting and they're randomly CGI. I can't think of any reason for it given a) one can still use suits and b) they go right back to suits anyways so.......?

Also, what is with Drive and people uploading to computers? :lol: First, Krim then Banno now Reiko's dad... is there some crazy scientist matrix in their world or something?

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by takenoko » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:32 pm

I guess I'll go against the trend and say I didn't like this one. My one word summary of it: Superfluous.

I like the characters, I like them all a lot actually, even Go from time to time. But these stories sucked. Genpachi's a great character, but he's pretty annoying when he's at the forefront and constantly shoving his old man slapstick in your face. I know Heart had to have a foil for his abundance of coolness, but maybe they could have just done a thing where he talked with his chorus the whole time. I like Brain and Medic, it would have been a fun time.

When did Rinna turn into a sexy librarian? She definitely looks better than she did in the series, at least. They made her look so old in that.

Why is Mach's story a weird horror sub plot? Sadly, I don't remember Reiko at all. She seems like a nice enough character, given the information I'm given in the flashbacks, which are appreciated. But why was she in jail again?

Is 005 mind controlling the girls into killing their dads, or is that what they want? Seems random? How does this help him win his daughter? Or is he trying to punish her? It's pretty unclear, since it doesn't seem like he's trying to frame her, she's just doing that to herself.

I'll give Mach some credit, since his story was a little more interesting than Heart's, but both stories have the problem of feeling like they're ripping at a fabric to find loose strings to patch up again. So does that mean that Go has learned to accept Chase's death and move on with his life? The main problem is that Mach was never really much of a character. He cared about his sister and that was his thing. Then he suddenly became interested in Chase, and that became his new thing. He also apparently stalks desperate women in prisons, guess that's his new thing? I'm just trying to say that I don't know enough about Shijima Go to care about a story about him!

Like Gaim Gaiden 2, this set was pretty much unnecessary. I like the characters and actors and am glad they got some work, but they didn't need to do this and it seemed pretty low effort. All the Mach/Drive designs look the same to me. I don't know what they swapped or changed.

And they need to stop filming bonus footage in that echoy room. Why do they do that? Do they pay the intern minimum wage to set those up? People on Youtube have better set ups than that.

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Catastrophe » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:43 pm

The Heart part was full of stupid slapstick which kind of ruins his character. Otta was a strange choice of character to pair him with.

Machs part was pretty decent though, nice that Go got a good end.

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by ViRGE » Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:42 am

Man have I missed Heart. He was always fantastic and it's a shame that he only got as much screentime as he did in the series proper. Go, on the other hand, is at best an acquired taste.

Heart: Although Heart coming back was convoluted - and I'm not sure there's any way to avoid that - it's good to have him back. And I'm glad that they brought back Brain and Medic as well, even if it's just as disembodied voices. Along with Shinnouske, it's those two that give him a meaningful connection to the rest of the world.

I don't think the writers quite nailed what business required Heart's return, but I do like the overall plot. He was always the villain (or at best an anti-hero), so it's nice to see him get to be the actual hero for once and do some good for humanity. And he did legitimately grow a bit in the process.

The weak point of this segment is of course Gen. I agree that Heart needed a human foil, but Gen's character is especially grating. The writers made it work, but I would have gladly taken someone else; someone a little more down to earth. The irony is that Gen makes a much better pairing with Rinna, which is why it was painful to see them fighting, even if it was always going to have a happy ending.

Random observations: Heart and Gen's actors ended up having to do a lot of fighting in the mud. I can only imagine how much that sucked, so kudos to them. And Medic's actress, unless I'm mistaken, they were in fact carrying her during that entire fight scene.:o

Mach: It wasn't until this movie that I really internalized just how much the series crapped all over Go for either humor or emotional turmoil. His father was a monster (and for all practical purposes the Big Bad), he never got a good upgrade of his own, his sister seriously tried dating a killer robot for a while, his powers got copied like they were nothing, his best friend died, and then he died. A lot. (Seriously, how many times has Go died or may as well have died between the series and all of the movies?)

Despite his suffering, I've never liked Go. The writers never did a good job humanizing him in the series. Though to be fair I'm not 100% sure if they were trying. Either way his over-the-top bravado and bull-headed nature made it hard to like him.
Yaiba wrote:I'm glad they chose "family" as the main focus on Mach's story, because that's what has been bothering Go, Kiriko and Chase for a good part of the series.
That's actually a really good observation. I checked the Wiki, and the 2-parter Reiko was in was the episode where we found out that Go's father was Banno. So it's very appropriate that his story ends on a similar note to where it began.

This is one area where I do think there was an opportunity for closure, and as such an opportunity for this movie. Go got closure on the Roidmudes and made peace with what his father did (by making pieces of him! :o ), but the larger subject of family was never fully addressed at the end of the series. Putting Reiko in this one does seem a bit forced, but I like how it's used as an avenue for humanizing Go (and blatantly calling out how he almost always hides his true self), which is something he needed badly.

Whether he deserves such a convenient happy ending is up for debate, I suppose. But I enjoyed that he got his closure.

Random observations: You know it's serious when Go slugs Shinnouske.:o And the stunt team did a good job with the wire-fu on Mach's half
takenoko wrote:Why is Mach's story a weird horror sub plot? Sadly, I don't remember Reiko at all. She seems like a nice enough character, given the information I'm given in the flashbacks, which are appreciated. But why was she in jail again?
She was one of the humans that fused with a Roidmude. A BSOD of sorts for what her father did. Her fall was used to contrast with Go's situation; she became obsessed and couldn't move past what her father did, while that deterred Go from following the same fate. (As an aside, that two-parter was also written by the same writer as the Mach half of the movie)
How does this help him win his daughter? Or is he trying to punish her? It's pretty unclear, since it doesn't seem like he's trying to frame her, she's just doing that to herself.
It doesn't seem like he's trying to frame her, but he's definitely trying to punish her. As we've seen before, her father is an outright psychopath and enjoys hurting people.
Lunagel wrote:holy crap breastfeeding in KR that's a first
That caught me off-guard as well. Which isn't a complaint, I'm just not sure what to make of it. When western writers do it, it's because they're trying to make a point of normalizing what's traditionally seen as an intimate act. But I'm not sure that's the case for Japan?

Actually, I'm not quite sure who these Saga movies are for. Between Chase getting seduced, the breast feeding, and Medic having entirely too much fun with Heart's body (complete with a penis joke, no less!), it's obviously not aimed at the primary KR toy-buying audience. I guess it's aimed at older, long-term fans? But even then some of this stuff is different enough that I'm not sure that theory fits.
Lunagel wrote:minus one point for coming wayyyyy too after the series to give a crap
Agreed in full. Even without the lag time for translation, the Wiki says this came out after Ex-Aid started; which is to say it came out after the series that followed Drive was already done. I had to go look up half of the stuff involving Go because I've forgotten it in the last year.

I know Toei has a very busy and particular film schedule they want, but these Saga movies should be out before the end of the following series. Ideally we should be seeing the second Saga movie in the second or third quarter of the next series' run. They're just hurting themselves here by waiting for so long.

So long, Drive. It's been a good run. :)

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Slazo » Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:31 am

A film of two halves. I loved Heart's saga, and it was a nice sendoff for Heart, Brain and Medic. The three of them had some good dialogue with each other, Gen played off well with them (though how he survived leaping off a tall bridge... yeah, let's forget that), and the villain being leftover code from the Roidmude made sense. A nice mini-mystery that made good use of all the elements of the series.

Mach's on the other hand, I found fairly boring. It just took far too long to accomplish far too little. The talk with Kiriko was good, but it and the climatic battle were the only good scenes in the whole thing. Especially the bit where he used the wheel in his gun to avoid tripping, that stuck out to me as neat. Otherwise, I spent half the time trying to remember who 005 and Reiko actually were (even after reading this thread I'm still struggling to recall those episodes). I don't dislike Mach as a character, but this felt like a waste to me. And did we really need another "he's dead" moment, the series and movies had already had enough fake deaths to last a lifetime...

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by Masked Rider » Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:01 am

I actually enjoyed it for what it's worth. It was fun to see the characters again and seeing what they've been up to.

Heart - Some good emotional moments here and there. Going out like a hero is always a cool thing.

Mach - That scene with him being hung is a bit....morbid. Even though he wasn't totally dead. And in the end, it seemed like a waste that he had spent so many years studying hard, only to throw it all away.

But like I said, I enjoyed it. Maybe it would have been better if the whole thing was just an hour long?

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by PTM966666 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:45 am

ok so Reiko is the daughter of the culprit in ep 0, and she appeared in ep 27-28 where she tricked Go to revenge her father. I think that using Reiko in Mach story is a pretty good choice since Go did have (kinda) an affair for her in the series. It's also good that they choose family as the theme for the whole movie, and let Go and Heart have proper endings rather than obsesses with reviving Chase and die in sadness in the series. There are still some points that bother me like how Go survived that hanging and where that shift car came from. Still overall it's a neat movie and enjoyable, 4/5 for me.

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Re: Kamen Rider Heart/Mach Released

Post by fenrir » Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:30 pm

a so so movie.
i give it a 3 or both series, but all the actor & actress done a GREAT job in here.

to be honest Drive is still a much better show rather than Ghost, if they don't start after Gaim, or perhaps if they start after Ghost (reverse sequence) i do think people will like the series more.

for the saga, i complete chase,mach,heart saga. all seems kinda so so.
1 thing i like about drive series is that the story have continuation and decent ending when shinosuke-kiriko married.
but somehow putting a saga seems kinda off a bit. but anyway, toei wants to sell more stuff i guess.

perhaps for the heart& mach saga, the story is kinda weak, family is a good theme which is appropriate for Drive, and mach saga try to make it really works, but as mentioned above, the story have many loopholes and yeah i also forgot who is reiko.

for heart, pairing with Gen indeed can emphasize the "heart" thing, but their pairing seems a bit off. probably if its going to be a longer series of buddy cop it would be good. but just not that work in it.
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