TV-Nihon

Again lets Keep it simple

Ghost - What a really bad series on the overal and like others I love the suit design and how is it that his best episodes are the ones in Zio as I actually liked him the characters there

Wizard - Thank god beast turned up and glad he was used in Zio as I loved this guy and that was it... and come on after the first episode who didnt guess White Wizard was actually the bad guy

Kiva - God this was a tough choice as apart from said two above I have always gained a enjoyment of every rider thats been past but was much as the problems with Hibiki the constant back and forth in the Kiva story line is what really annoyed me when the simple solution would of been have one episode in the present and one in the past as the story line was good enough to support it it

As for Zio it dont hit the bottom but its close storyline wise but my main gripe is why did we not see Armour times for All the riders even if it was just for a single fight.

I couldn't really make a third choice, but I can talk about my two least favourite Heisei Riders.

Wizard, as others have said, was overly long and empty. It played way too safe, not really allowing Haruto to fail. Considering his whole schtick was about hope, as a character he needed to fail so he could pull it together and succeed afterwards; the most powerful thing they did with this was having him lose Dragon and regain it by believing in himself, which is fine, but I wanted to see him fall into despair and succumb to the monster in his heart. Or even just... fail. Like, have him unable to save everyone who is a Gate. Having him fail to save someone, and having a powerful end-game boss come out of it, would have been a really solid progression.

I remember the threads for the show as it aired, how much I did not want Wiseman to be the White Wizard, and how disappointed I was when they went for the most obvious twist. It had a ton of potential, and so many of its ideas where predicated on an instability that should have really generated so much interesting content; and yet, they just told a really long, drawn-out story about a guy who sorta effortlessly wins. It was an awkward show, and I feel like if they had just trusted the work more it could have been something interesting.

Ghost was the absolute nadir of the Heisei era. It had a cool idea (a dimension of uneasy dead souls is invading the world of the living, and only our also-dead hero can stop them; also, the two friends both trying to explain the goings-on via their vastly different worldviews), cool twists along the way (the hard turn from supernatural to crazy scifi really hooked me), then at the end it lost itself and wound up with this weird ending in which Takeru was legitimately dead the whole series and was the only person who was. The concepts and how they progress really lent themselves to a show in which people are troubled by the implications of what's going on, but they mostly just breezed past it all; I think due to the show being for kids, they really couldn't ruminate on the significance of what the EyeCon system was doing, how it was somehow capturing the "spirits" of outright fictional characters and later how Mugen was powered by emotions. There's a subtext in Ghost which begs for a real deep dive, but the format of Kamen Rider just couldn't go there, and it's sad to have wasted a real thinkpiece concept. What are spirits? Is life worth hanging onto, and how far should one go in that pursuit? I mean, the show literally had a Buddhist monk as a main character, a man whose faith is about how pain is everywhere yet transitory and thus you cannot hold onto it if you're to have a life worth living. The themes are right there, the staff put them into the show, but then ignored them entirely.

faiz, kabuto, and ryuki for me

If Ghost died again . . . no one would care . . .
Hated the stupid chibi level one riders in Ex-Aid . . .
Decade was just . . . bad . . .

3rd - Hibiki. I originally liked how vastly different the show is in terms of style, pacing and even the concept of Riders itself, but the retooled 2nd half totally burned off my interest in the show and took away things that made the first half special.

2nd - Wizard. Not a bad show, but just boring. Haruto have little to no character development. There really isn't much conflict or struggles that he has to go through. The supporting characters (except for Beast) started off strong, but fell by the wayside into pure comic reliefs. Granted, Gremlin becoming the final villain was probably the most interesting twist the show pulled off, but that's about it.

1st - Ghost. Ohh boy, what an absolute nightmare watching this show during its run. It had some interesting concepts and underlying themes, but the show often dumbs itself down simply because it's a kid's show. And it's frustrating for the older audiences who can see those underlying themes, but the show just never fully dive into them. I love the suits in Ghost, especially Mugen. But everything after the Alain arc just went to shit. The reuse of the same MOTW in episodes after episodes either speak laziness or low in budget, and the Gammaizers arc were boring as hell. Takeru just never appealed to me as a lead Rider, and little growth/maturity was shown in his own series proper, instead, he was portrayed to have matured greatly in Zi-O. I remember wishing week after week for Ghost to quickly end so we can get on to the next series.

Just my own personal opinion. Sorry if I trashed on anyone's favourite series. Peace out.

1. Hibiki - Not really hype about this one. The mentor-student relationship and Hibiki's design might be the only thing I liked about this show.

2. Wizard- lackluster gem-head and overall design and plot.

3. Den-O - I tried to keep up on this one but I personally felt like this time-travel thingy with Den-O and the imagins are quite a mess... I never liked Nogami, I liked the Imagins. The mystery of Sakurai can't even kept me long from my seat... I think it's the characters I had problems with. Sorry.

X. Build - While this started very very very strong, it ended with quite a mess and that really disappoints me. The last quarter of the series already had revealed quite a handful of mysteries that kept the show very interesting in its first half and pretty much messed up the plot IMO.

Interesting to see some of the views of why people dislike/like some of these series. Personally, I have only one that I really couldn't get into, despite trying, even though I haven't made it through all of them yet, and that was Hibiki. I don't know why, I just couldn't get into it. But, I appreciate everyone who's taken the time to actually discuss the pros and cons of the different ones they've liked, or disliked as the case may be. Once I can catch up on some I haven't been able to get through, that may change though. Heh.

555 - I basically hate 555, but I can see why people think it's really cool. The Riders are very stylistic, and the basic premise is very cool, even if I feel like Inoue isn't good enough a writer to make full use of the themes and ideas. I can see why people would put this on the bottom with the lack of focus on an end goal, leading to a kick-you-in-the-balls ending.

555 is the show that got me into Heisei Rider, so I'm surely biased. Also, I haven't watch it in year so my memories may not be that accurate, but I totally loved it except for the ending not resolving much. Except for that, what do you hate so much about it?

I mean I don't really hate any if the ones I like the least. I just like them the least.

Zi-O is kinda terrible but I don't hate it.

dancercotillion wrote: ↑Tue Sep 03, 2019 9:36 am There's a subtext in Ghost which begs for a real deep dive, but the format of Kamen Rider just couldn't go there, and it's sad to have wasted a real thinkpiece concept. What are spirits? Is life worth hanging onto, and how far should one go in that pursuit? I mean, the show literally had a Buddhist monk as a main character, a man whose faith is about how pain is everywhere yet transitory and thus you cannot hold onto it if you're to have a life worth living. The themes are right there, the staff put them into the show, but then ignored them entirely.

Y'know, I really never considered it that way, but you raise a good point. Ghost's plot sounds really cool whenever I talk about it to anyone, but I hardly ever felt that way when I was watching the show. Even the element of some ghosts becoming humans when they die sounded like a neat reversal, but I never got that out of the show until after the series was over.

I probably won't vote for now as I've only seen 3 rider series from start to finish so far, but I will say that Build had a few issues with plotholes (primarily, if the main character would rather die than use the Hazard Trigger, why did he bring it with him all the time?).

I feel a bit like cheating, due to not having seen Hibiki or Zi-O but, if in the first case it's just a matter of not having much time to dedicate to the viewing, in Zi-O case it's just that its themes really don't appeal to me the slightest.

Anyway, I voted Decade, Wizard and Ghost but I have to say i don't hate these series. Like I said in the other thread about the favourite series, for my choices I mostly reasoned using my "rewatch meter" and those series are at the bottom of such scale. Other series like Den-O or Faiz are pretty low on my "meter" but I felt these three are at the lowest, even if I had to struggle for the third place (Ghost) due the aforementioned series.

Wizard really didn't managed to hook me up. I had some nice design, like the main suits, but they just kept piling stuff on stuff making the design looking more and more cluttered. Yet, it's something I can bear with but the overall story and character really felt forgettable for my tastes. The overall mix never really managed to suck me in and never made me crave for another episode. It felt less and less interesting to watch, never having something thrilling or exciting. It's probably just a matter of tastes.

Same for Ghost: it felt like a chore after a certain number of episodes. Some nice ideas in terms of designs and costumes but, again, I couldn't get hooked. I can't even say I particularly dislike some element because most of them failed to stick in my mind. Still, I initially felt like Ghost's theme to be extremely interesting, compared to Wizard: exploring the them of spirits, souls and afterlife could have been much more interesting yet probably could have been too much of a philosophical matter to handle for such a show. Yet if felt they really didn't try a lot to delve into it. I guess I like Ghost more between the two.

Then comes Decade: even having less episodes than other series, it felt like a chore to me. I really wasn't into borrowed/stolen powers, it's something I never was a fan of. It worked in Gokaiger for me because of their theme and, even if still think that's a mechanic that rob the uniqueness of who use it, it was well implemented in the story. A story that had very likable characters for mostly of it and that made me forget about the gimmick and care more about the cast and the abundant cameos. There is nothing of this in Decade for me. Through the series I wasn't really able to sympathize with the characters, especially Tsukasa. I wasn't blown away by Inoue interpretation, I really feel he works best in the Garo universe. And the other characters too... I really wasn't fond of Natsuki, not to mention Yusuke but in that case I'm most probably biased because of how much I like Kuuga. The story seems like they had initially an idea but they kept switching ideas and themes, ending up an a quite messy job, even if it has its rare fun moments. Still, not a fan of overpowered, obnoxious characters just for the sake of being that.

If there is something that I really, really like it's Decade's suit. It's extremely original, a really bold move in many aesthetic decisions not to mention that lovely magenta. It really stand out and it's for me the best achievement of the series.

it's funny i feel like a lot of people haven't watched all 20 heisei riders, Cause Agito was fucking GARBAGE. Like it made no sense half the time and it was like they couldn't figure out if it was it's own thing or a follow up to Kuuga.

Ghost is also Garbage.

and Build was pretty bad.

I'd put Hibiki at no 4 but it's not really it's fault it got a bad ending.

Aeikozz wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:01 am it's funny i feel like a lot of people haven't watched all 20 heisei riders, Cause Agito was fucking GARBAGE. Like it made no sense half the time and it was like they couldn't figure out if it was it's own thing or a follow up to Kuuga.

W-what?

I don't think it was beholden to Kuuga. There was just a nod that Kuuga happened. And I suppose the reason G3 was weak is because it was never meant to fight the Unknown.

No other Kuuga references exist.

Not to mention the characters were likable. My only criticism is the writer's urge to constantly have bad things happen to people outside of Shouichi.