Overall thoughts on this series?

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Dengar
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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by Dengar » Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:51 am

butyoumight wrote:
Shunpei - Everyone would've thought he'd be the secondary rider or a third rider. Seeing that he's not actually learning any magic, I don't see the need for him to be there either. Other then for comic relief, but he really isn't cast in that role.
Not sure how so many people have missed this and always view Shunpei as an extraneous comic relief character, but Shunpei is one of the best 'Civilian Wranglers' I can remember in recent Kamen Rider memory. He's always right there to support the Gate, to get them out of there if need be. If Shunpei is present, it's basically guaranteed that the Riders don't have to waste time worrying directly about the Gate until they drive the Phantom off/destroy it. It's actually my favorite thing about Shunpei, is how quickly he rises to that challenge, and how GOOD AT IT he is.

So, yeah, I see plenty of reason for Shunpei to be there.

So basically he's a little more than the guy that goes "Takumi! Orphenoch!".

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by locuas » Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:18 pm

i think kotaro from Blade is still better than shunpei.
the problem with shunpei is that he is comic relief, and a good part of his scenes are comedy, and comedy is very subjective. so, if you do not find the comedy...you know...funny, he is annoying as hell.

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by Kamen Rider Unknown » Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:42 pm

locuas wrote:the problem with shunpei is that he is comic relief, and a good part of his scenes are comedy, and comedy is very subjective. so, if you do not find the comedy...you know...funny, he is annoying as hell.
You hit it Right On The Head. :D

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by RaiZenGar » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:00 pm

I think Wizard is easily the worst Kamen Rider I've watched--a spot that was previously held by Decade. The story isn't good, the pacing of the already bad story is terrible, the characters range from bland to annoying, the villains are comically terrible at their one job that they do simply because they're told to and have no personal stake in.

The only acceptable villains were Phoenix and Gremlin. Phoenix was great because he had something he wanted and did things. Sora, god bless his psychopathic heart, tried his best to advance the plot. On the other hand, Medusa isn't a character yet. She does everything just because she was told to and has no personal motivation. Wiseman is shrouded in "mystery" and by mystery, I mean they won't tell us anything, so we're supposed to think he's mysterious, but I can't get past my apathy towards the plot.

The execution of the Gate premise is also terrible. Haruto has no consequences for screwing up because if he fails to protect their hope, he just goes inside them and fixes it. In 40 episodes, not a single new Phantom has been born. That's abysmal. The villains don't seem like a threat because they can't accomplish the modest goals they've set out to. Only a handful of Phantoms have actually had plans that make sense to make people despair and most of them ruin it by appearing and gloating/telling them to despair harder so Wizard and/or Beast can defeat them. Of course, even if they don't ruin their own plan to make someone really, really sad, Wizard and Beast can always fall back on Engage.

This brings me to my next point, Haruto is laughably bad at his job. All of the Gates he didn't use Engage on are ticking time bombs and still potential Phantoms. If they ever face any mundane, non-monster induced tragedy, they're screwed. In fact, he sent one of them over seas and told her the person she loves that he killed is still alive over there. Good luck with that one! Better hope she never finds out.

Mayu was handled awfully. She was gone for quite a while and instead of coming back as her own Kamen Rider, they just gave her the generic Kamen Rider Mage suit that everyone in the movie uses. She's someone who overcame becoming a Phantom in the same way as Haruto which is assumedly rare and special, but her suit (which I am not a fan of) does not reflect this.

A couple years ago, I got my roommate into watching Kamen Rider with me starting with OOO. He generally enjoyed OOO and Fourze and thought they were okay. He abhors Wizard and has wanted to quit multiple times, but has decided to stick it out--probably to see if there's any sort of pay off at the end. I proposed we start an older Kamen Rider series because I wanted to rewatch them and he's never seen them. I chose Faiz and he loves it so far because the plot is continuously advancing, people have relationships that grow and change, people have lives outside of being a Kamen Rider and it continuously juggles multiple story threads.

I feel like I could go on for a while about why I think Wizard is awful, but I feel like I'll end on a couple of the things I do like and some speculation.

In general, I like the way Wizard fights and his general design (minus the rings, they should have been much smaller). I'm not a huge fan of the Four Swords power up, but all the Dragon forms are pretty cool. I like the White Wizard's driver and it's commanding tone. In general, I've enjoyed Phoenix and Gremlin, but that's about it.

The only way I think the story makes sense is if creating new Phantoms is absolutely not Wiseman's actual goal, and the goal this entire time was to power up Haruto through battle for some ulterior purpose (probably Philosopher Stone related).

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by Go-On Macaroni » Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:43 am

RaiZenGar wrote:I chose Faiz and he loves it so far because the plot is continuously advancing, people have relationships that grow and change, people have lives outside of being a Kamen Rider and it continuously juggles multiple story threads.
Um, were we watching the same show? Because, that sounds like a much better Faiz than the one I saw.
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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by RaiZenGar » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:58 am

Go-On Macaroni wrote:
RaiZenGar wrote:I chose Faiz and he loves it so far because the plot is continuously advancing, people have relationships that grow and change, people have lives outside of being a Kamen Rider and it continuously juggles multiple story threads.
Um, were we watching the same show? Because, that sounds like a much better Faiz than the one I saw.
We're only a bit over half way though at the moment, and it's been a while, so I don't remember a whole lot about the way Faiz ends, but I think the series mostly falls apart at the end. So far, basically every episode has advanced the plot, there's a lot of time each episode dedicated to personal relationships and earlier in the series to their everyday lives. But this isn't quite the place to discuss Faiz, I only meant to use it as a contrast for my roommates reaction to Wizard.

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by dancercotillion » Thu Jul 04, 2013 8:52 am

Faiz is a much better series than Wizard, and not just because Wizard would randomly have a spell to increase his tongue's tolerance of hot food rather than be a gigantic wuss about soup. I gave a damn about Takumi's problems and saving people from Orphenoch, but I don't really care about Haruto being absolutely everyone's final hope. It's boring and he always wins.

Wizard is a show where absolutely nothing happens. The characters are mostly dull and pointless, and even the villains have this sense of apathy where they never win and there's not even an idea of what their goal is. I think Wizard is probably the worst of the modern Rider shows, it's uninspired and incredibly shallow.
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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by TNT » Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:32 pm

I don't really know what draws me to some rider shows more than others. I seem to have a really fragile balance of things I need to like before I can permanently commit. (belt sounds, special effects, fight choreo, characters, story premise)

Wizard managed to get there despite having some real problems.
- Haruto was at first dull and played as a typical ace rider. However to me he has grown quite bit. We learned his ace side was more of a facade and we saw him coming to terms with having magic.
- Dragon Whatever happened to Dragon begin angry and preying on Haruto's heart? He had this Naruto Kyubi thing going that sort off went up in smoke. :?
- Koyomi we don't know anything about her, but I really want to know what is her deal. I also think the charactisation she has had was excellent. The brother sister dynamic with Haruto and her actress seeming to always be lost in the background really works for her.
- Shunpei...is Shunpei. Like many I expected him to become the second rider. It would've really allowed his character to grow. As it stands he's just weird (what is his day job anyway?) and in the way. He adds nothing that Rinko wasn't already adding.
- Rinko I like her. She's like a competent Shunpei. She has an actual job that the writers managed to take advantage of in a believable way. (Phoenix conversation being the primary example) Having an active policeforce also makes the world feel more alive somehow. I also like her interactions with Haruto. It's either potential girlfriend or brother sister. It's nice not to have it so blatant.
- Wajima Who?
- Nitou I had such high hopes for him. A secondary rider who doesn't know anything about the main plot! Awesome! But he managed to become the worst rider I have ever seen. His powers aren't very good (dice saber!), though the primary problem is his usage of them. Maybe they meant to do this since he's had no formal training, but still he keeps making horrible decisions in his mantels and his super form can't even access them. He seems to be there just for the Ghouls and the Ghouls are there so he doesn't die. It would have been awesome if he had died and Shunpei got his belt. I do like the happy face his actor can make.
- Khimaira: I also had high hopes for Khimaira, but I don't think we'll be seeing him again....

Donut shop is the worst hang out place ever....

Phantoms: I don't have a ready opinion yet since the story is not over yet. I agree with what's been said above me about how Medusa is just following orders and how they haven't managed to get a single goal. However to me it currently seems like Wiseman doesn't care about it anyway. So my final opinion depends on the CLIMAX!
Still, Phoenix was one of the best KR villain ever and Gremlin is also great.

Originally they were carefull with the ring usage and I even praised them in the earlier episodes for using rings that were introduced earlier in the show so that they weren't just plot convience single use spells. Unfortunately they stopped with that somewhere half way and now Haruto seems to have a single use spell for many situations. -_-
I hate how so many Phantoms just casually stroll away with noone giving chase. <_<
I really like how many calls backs they've had to earlier parts of the show. From Haruto never answering Rinko's question about his dream to using the sleep ring 3 or 4 eps after it's introduction.
The fight choreo is marvelous.
I like some of the humor, but most of it comes from Nitou working with either Rinko or Haruto. He needs either a straight man (his slightly aroused look when Rinko undressed Shunpei for the MIND CONTROLLING DEVICE) or to be in the background (hand goggles!) to be funny.
Mayu should've returned sooner. They should've made her a magical girl. I mean come on how could they not!!
I also like how they occasionally address perfectly valid questions like wether Haruto can't free Nitou from Khimaira. (And another call back to this 10 episodes later)


It's no Double, but its not bad either. Most of this can change if the pay off is crap.

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by Kamen Rider Unknown » Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:16 pm

O.K. so we are all in agreement that the writing and the character's development. SUCKS :(

We are also in agreement that the costumes (minus Mayu's) and fight scenes. KICK-ASS :D

TNT wrote:- Wajima Who?
You know....the guy that makes all of the "Wizard Rings" :mrgreen:


Still, I look forward to seeing how it all ends.

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Re: Overall thoughts on this series?

Post by Phoenix512 » Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:00 pm

I think it's premature to give an overall thought of a series before it's over with. For now, I'm going to lock this thread and unlock when the series is over with.
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