I guess the Koman-centering was mainly due to Tsuburaya trying to do a different kind of Ultraman style (maybe to give viewers someone to look up to instead of someone to relate to), but I think the big reason behind focusing on Komon was to lead up to the end whereimprialdrz wrote:Thanks for the info, now I see why the ending feel so rushed and quite unclear compared to others. (although I am still not quite sure where EX episode will be filled in).
The thing I don't like about Himeya chapter (and nexus overall) is the story described from Komon point of view, rather than 3rd person. This make overall story become Komon centered. For example the one I never understand:
Spoiler
When the first time Komon fly the jet, he fly one alone, while 4 others more experienced people fly it with help from others
Well, you have a point there, Ginga is much worse ( would give -5 if I can) compared to Nexus.
On another note, Himeya is more like Fujimiya (Ultraman Agul) in Gaia. Lone hero with complex personality (and also got injured alot because he the injury he got from becoming ultraman).
Before I answer this question, let me say that my most favorite ultraman series are the 3 heisei ultraman (Tiga, Dyna, Gaia). For me to consider these series as the greatest, let me compare it to nexus.Mxylv wrote: Incidentally, @Godai Yuusuke, what are your views on Nexus?
Gaia is not even half the size the size of this monster teeth!!! Thanks for the info,Godai Yuusuke wrote: Now for rating, based on the facts above, will give it 2.5 (5 to Tiga and Gaia, 4 to Dyna)
Mostly the first and last monsters.
Hmmm, it certainly great song, but not epic (at least for me), as I think Tiga opening song is far better.Mxylv wrote:Thanks for the info,Godai Yuusuke wrote: Now for rating, based on the facts above, will give it 2.5 (5 to Tiga and Gaia, 4 to Dyna)
I haven't seen that much yet from the series you've mentioned, partially because I have yet to find a good fansub for Gaia. *checks out forum's main page* Hmmm....
Anyway, because of this you'd certainly be better at comparing the shows, so I'm going to try to rate the show as a standalone series.
What grabbed me so much about TLT was its dark and questionable undertone. In many previous iterations of the show, the organization was (usually) a good-hearted, sometimes slightly incompetent patrol who fought Kaiju until Ultraman arrived in time to beat it. I'm all for the classic approach in many series (much else would probably get boring after a while), but TLT's tactics of lies, memory wipes and even its willingness tofelt like a complete re-imagining of the Earth-defense organization. In short, although I liked its slightly more realistic take on an underground patrol (black/navy blue uniforms), the real reason why I thought TLT was brilliant of Tsuburaya was the fact that, despite theoretically being the "good guys," TLT were willing to justify just about anything for the "greater good." I agree that more members would've been good, though.Spoiler
potentially kill an Ultraman just to enhance their weaponry
As for the designs, I really agree on your choice of Gaia's jets/mechas; those are some awesome machines, and a flying fortress does make for a cool base. In terms of the design of the Ultramen, I liked Nexus best (mainly due to the Samurai influence for his helmet, the Junis form's shoulder armor, the darker look in general and), but since "best design" can be subjective anyway, that may be just me. The Kaiju... yeah, I guess it showed that they weren't going for a monster-of-the-week structure. Still, I feel like one or two deserved some credit:Spoiler
the chrome+wings on his Ultimate Noa form
Spoiler
If it helps, this is some of what we would've gotten if Nexus wasn't canceled early. I kinda like the plant one: http://ultra.wikia.com/wiki/Unused_Spac ... aman_Nexus
Again, I can't really compare the stories to Tiga/Dyna/Gaia, but as a standalone series, Nexus blew my mind. The story arc that included a guilt-stricken, suffering host who doesn't know why he was chosen for most of his run, a villain who would kill and resurrect someone to play games with the protagonist's mind, and rising ethical questions with the organization sometimes seemed more interesting than the Space Beast side of the story itself. Some of why I like it actually reminds me of why you like Gaia:Again, I'm not saying it's better or worse than other shows, just that the balance it struck between human-level emotion and Ultra-level action was amazing for me. Almost every character ended up with a backstory, from the antagonist to the man behind the organization.Spoiler
From what I'm getting, both have a massive clash in ideals between people who are theoretically on the same side, even if Gaia and Nexus use this in different ways.
Just a quick question before I close--do either of you have any thoughts on the soundtrack for the series? I think this is the only Ultraman show that particular composer worked on (needless to say, I thought it was epic), so just wondering on that.
Also, dang--I just realized how stereotyped I look for a Nexus supporter with my avatar and all
Junis red really is awesome. Dang, I hate it when rating polls get locked though...imprialdrz wrote: for ultraman design, still agree with Mxylv, nexus design still the best, especially junis red, pretty colorful.
Thinking again from the different aspects, want to change my preference to 2 or 3.... just too bad I cant
Yeah, it is become very silly and disturbing...Mxylv wrote:Thanks for the information,
even if the mythos was getting rather silly.
You mean Cosmos?Mxylv wrote: predecessor's theme matched the motif of kindness.
Too bad thatMxylv wrote: I really like the idea of Ultramen with opposing views, though. In one series two Ultraman oppose each other morally, in another Ultraman and the patrol oppose views andMan, these two are sounding more and more similar in entirely different ways. What you said about Gaia being really confusing also reminds me of Nexus: although, again, I wouldn't be a good judge on similarities, there's also a lot going on in Nexus that starts out completely unexplained, and the answersSpoiler
diplomacy rarely works in either case.gave knowledge a bit of an edge.Spoiler
--particularly that TLT is part of the problem--
Yup, that's the one. As a bit of a side note, it seems like each series alternates between darker and lighter until the more balanced Mebius happened.Godai Yuusuke wrote: You mean Cosmos?
We certainly would! I felt like one Nexus did right was have Ultraman be a Warrior of Light who represented goodness. Having himGodai Yuusuke wrote:Too bad thatMxylv wrote: In one series two Ultraman oppose each other morally, in another Ultraman and the patrol oppose views andMan, these two are sounding more and more similar in entirely different ways.Spoiler
diplomacy rarely works in either case.Spoiler
Nexus never attack them even though he get attacked several times, otherwise, we will really have very interesting Ultraman story
I'd have to see the other series, but one explanation may be that a lot of the more colorful and flashier effects are gone. Dyna's Solgent Ray, for instance, had an complex, epic blue-violet beam, whereas Nexus' Over Ray Storm was basically a revamp of the classic Specium Ray. Tsuburaya seemed to be going for a good story over great effects (or great Kaiju design), but I don't know... it could have had a lower budget. The only real complaint I had with the effects was with the CGI, but Ginga's the only Ultraman show I know of that had a reeealy low budget. As the Star Wars prequels discovered, effects can be best with moderation, but I think it was some combination of budget and realism (unless the CGI was notably worse).Godai Yuusuke wrote: Ah, forget one thing I don't like about Nexus.... somehow the fighting scene and visual effects seems quite outdated (we see improvement from Tiga-Dyna-Gaia-Cosmos, but suddenly there is a big quality drop with Nexus). I don't know if it budget related thing or not, but if they really want to make adult show, they really need to pay much attention to every details.
Did'nt notice it until you pointed it out.....Mxylv wrote:
As a bit of a side note, it seems like each series alternates between darker and lighter until the more balanced Mebius happened.
Hmm, although seems reasonable, I prefer if they did take visual effects seriously also. Imagine if the story so great, but somehow the effects so bad( like we watched 1960s Ultraman, even though it is produced in 2000s/2010s) it will really kill the mood as in every Ultraman, fighting with monster probably take 15% of each episode time.Mxylv wrote:
Tsuburaya seemed to be going for a good story over great effects (or great Kaiju design)
Now I see why Ginga don't have fighting team and mechas, which really kill the franchise (for me, Ultraman must have 3 basic components, fighting team (with mechas, base, soldier uniform), Ultraman fighting in city (see lot of building get destroyed) and monsters).Mxylv wrote:
but Ginga's the only Ultraman show I know of that had a reeealy low budget
Well, never see Neos, but Nexus is really far away compared to Cosmos effects and battle scenarios. First we have Tiga, and then Dyna appeared with better visual effects and design (base, fighter etc), after that Gaia with memorable effect (land being exploded when he jump) and better effect than before, and Cosmos also improved its visual effects (and especially fighting scene) compared to Gaia, but somehow, Nexus effects and battle scenes are worse even compared to Tiga (and those CGI scenes is quite disturbing). It really have the potential to be the best, but somehow they neglect many important details (fighting team base, mechas, number of personel, visual effects, monster design, rarely see building destroyed (except 2-3 last episode)) which hurt this series as a whole. Even worse, they cut this series in the middle, which make it become unclear and confusing.Mxylv wrote:
What do you think about the effects of Cosmos compared to Gaia/Nexus (or possibly to Neos) in terms of effects?
Certainly--I have no idea why the effects weren't better. I tend to classify effects into the two categories, though: flashy (e.g. the Solgent Ray) and realistic (good greenscreen work, equal lighting with compositing, etc). There weren't many revealing mistakes in the series to me (mostly just bad CGI with the occasional greenscreen error), but the extra effects (like the ground exploding you mentioned in Gaia) were kinda lacking. Of course, I'd guess the lower episodes would be on a lower budget due to reasons explained later in the post, and I don't know if Max returned to a better-than-cosmos budget. Ultraman X seems to be a return to form, though.Godai Yuusuke wrote:Hmm, although seems reasonable, I prefer if they did take visual effects seriously also. Imagine if the story so great, but somehow the effects so bad.
Agreed on Ginga (and good list by the way). Between that and the merchandising it felt more like Kaching-ga.Godai Yuusuke wrote:Now I see why Ginga don't have fighting team and mechas, which really kill the franchise (for me, Ultraman must have 3 basic components, fighting team (with mechas, base, soldier uniform), Ultraman fighting in city (see lot of building get destroyed) and monsters).
I've seen the opening and I really agree on the land-exploding effect.Godai Yuusuke wrote: We have Gaia with memorable effect (land being exploded when he jump).
While it's true that the team number is limited, what I liked about it was that almost all the individual team members had their own personal story. Komon and Nagi had some backstory, Shiori got a fantastic story on the DVD release, Captain Wataru was a very human take on a leader, and later on we see even more backstory show up, particularly withGodai Yuusuke wrote:It really have the potential to be the best, but somehow they neglect many important details (fighting team base, mechas, number of personel, visual effects, monster design, rarely see building destroyed (except 2-3 last episode)) which hurt this series as a whole.
Some of that may have been the scheduling. As you may know, somewhere up the chain of command the Powers That Be somehow decided Nexus was a kid's show and dumped it on a kid's show schedule. As a result, the show got terrible ratings, was cut 13 episodes and when they reran it to the proper audience it was too late to save the episodes. The sudden switch in the middle was probably part of an attempt to get the audience they had to watch the series: add lots of kids, focus on a much younger person, and have part of it even take place at a doughnut shop. I'm personally glad they got it back to a darker show afterward, though--they they were going down, so they may as well do it with style. Although they would've gotten to the switch at some point, it may have not been nearly as stark a change had the scheduling gone right.Godai Yuusuke wrote:Even worse, they cut this series in the middle, which make it become unclear and confusing.
Try to watch it again, not sure why, but I feel the lightning seems a bit unmatched, but it might be only me, though.Mxylv wrote: There weren't many revealing mistakes in the series to me (mostly just bad CGI with the occasional greenscreen error)
Yeah......Mxylv wrote: Agreed on Ginga (and good list by the way). Between that and the merchandising it felt more like Kaching-ga.
What do you think about its mechas and base? For me, compared to land exploding effect, the mechas are more memorable (especially Fighter EX). Talking about it, now I realllllly wish there are Gaia fansub so I can watch it again....Mxylv wrote: I've seen the opening and I really agree on the land-exploding effect.
Hmm, I tend to agree that they should stick with original plan, rather than swing between dark-lighter-dark. I wish that they don't cut it in the middle, so we have more solid story and character development (as I think they focused too much with Komon, but again, it maybe only me).Mxylv wrote: Some of that may have been the scheduling. As you may know, somewhere up the chain of command the Powers That Be somehow decided Nexus was a kid's show and dumped it on a kid's show schedule. As a result, the show got terrible ratings, was cut 13 episodes and when they reran it to the proper audience it was too late to save the episodes. The sudden switch in the middle was probably part of an attempt to get the audience they had to watch the series: add lots of kids, focus on a much younger person, and have part of it even take place at a doughnut shop. I'm personally glad they got it back to a darker show afterward, though--they they were going down, so they may as well do it with style. Although they would've gotten to the switch at some point, it may have not been nearly as stark a change had the scheduling gone right.
I might've missed that. To be honest, I'd expected the effects to be a bit dated, so I didn't have a problem with them that much (although better effects wouldn't have been unwelcome). That said, I felt like the CGI actually got better as the series progressed, particularly with Ultraman himself. I also thought the CGI effects had improved from some of its predecessors, particularly Dyna from the first episode of Ultraman Retsuden (at around 15:30; there's a link below), but that's probably just evolving technology.Godai Yuusuke wrote:Try to watch it again, not sure why, but I feel the lightning seems a bit unmatched, but it might be only me, though.
I also really liked the fighters from Gaia; the aerial base in particular really looks awesome. I particularly liked the land exploding effect because it added to the "giant" feel of Ultraman. Again, I particularly like it that the current Ultraman X is returning to ground explosions with dirt and debris thrown into the air. That said, I also really wish there was a fansub of Gaia. Well, we are on the TV-Nihon forum, so anything's possible...Godai Yuusuke wrote:What do you think about its mechas and base? For me, compared to land exploding effect, the mechas are more memorable (especially Fighter EX). Talking about it, now I realllllly wish there are Gaia fansub so I can watch it again....
Yeah; thankfully, they seemed to decide pretty quickly that they wanted the darker tone back. I felt like the focus on Komon helped to glue together the two halves, but it may have made a bit more sense if we'd gotten all 50 episodes.Godai Yuusuke wrote:Hmm, I tend to agree that they should stick with original plan, rather than swing between dark-lighter-dark. I wish that they don't cut it in the middle, so we have more solid story and character development (as I think they focused too much with Komon, but again, it maybe only me).
imprialdrz wrote:Mxylv wrote:Sorry... terrible monster design?
I beg to differ on the "non-memorable" issue.
So, why did you rate it 1/5? I found Komon's girlfriend being a puppet made to toy with his mind quite interesting, and for some of it Himeya himself doesn't know which world is real. Also: Nexus summons the Meta-Field (alternate dimension) to protect others from harm. Ultraman isn't a dream, but the show is purposefully confusing because of the mind games of Mizorogi, the Kaiju, and even...Spoiler
the organization itself.
I think what's going on is that you haven't seen enough of the show for them to explain what you're bringing up. I'm not sure you've seen anything past Episode 12 or 13 based on your questions, so if you give it another shot, I can guarantee the show will explain a lot of confusing things you had questions about.
I've seen the whole series and I'd like to say that Nexus is arguably the best show ever made.
That's what I called memorable. not something like these:
Nope, you are wrong, I watched it until end before I give the score. I admit that Ren story is quite interesting, but the ending destroyed it (when komon become Ultraman, and night riders more like a patrol group after Zagi defeated). The ultraman design is the best compared to others, but we are talking about story here,so still (1/5).
Himeya Chapter (1/5)
Ren Chapter (3/5)
Ending (0/5)
