Kiramager Episode 37 released

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Ratings

Poll ended at Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:56 pm

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5
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Total votes: 21
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by ViRGE »

Hmm. That was an okay episode. But I have to admit I found it unfulfilling in the end.

The big issue, as a couple other people have already noted, is that it feels like two A-plots smashed together. Sena being split up or Emperor Yodom showing his ugly face would under normal circumstances be their own A-plots, with ample time for each to breathe. Instead we get both plots in a single episode, and I don't feel like either one is as developed as it needs to be.

Of the two plots, the Sena plot thankfully ends up getting the bulk of the attention. I've always wondered what would happen if Yodonna's split-up power was used on a ranger, so now we finally get the answer to that: so much Sena! :D Splitting up your character into multiple exaggerated personality subtypes is a bit of a heavy-handed trope - there's no subtlety to it as you're literally splitting your character to focus on one aspect of them - but it's certainly appropriate for a show like Super Sentai. Sena is definitely the ranger closest to a Genki Girl to begin with, so her pessimistic/doubtful side isn't something we've seen much of this season, not even in her other focus episodes.

And wow, the writers didn't hold back here; they had their opportunity to go to a dark place with a downer character, and took it. Getting a team member back when they feel low is under normal circumstances more of a cookie-cutter plot for Sentai, but then those characters aren't a) So single-track downers, and b) trying to kill themselves.:shock: Given Japan's suicide problem I'm sure there are some cultural implications that are going over my head, but still, I'm surprised they went in such a serious direction.

The payoff, however, was some great character moments. Downer Sena shrieking at Sayo about coming to save her, and then the chase into the sea is a powerful scene. Sayo going on about how the team needs Downer Sena was done exceptionally well. It's not only a good use of the "emotional" character, but both actresses were in top form there. Which is no small feat when the two of them are sitting in the sea on what's clearly not a warm day.:o Ultimately that entire scene is all carefully engineered to generate this kind of a reaction (you shoot at the ocean like that specifically to make a hard-hitting scene), so the outcome is no accident, but kudos to Toei & the cast on being on top of their tradecraft here.

So why am I unfulfilled after all of that? Because in what would have been a high-tier episode on its own, we get the stupid Emperor Yodom plot bolted on to the end. Not only was it essentially unrelated to the Sena plot (the only shared factor was Yodonna), but Yodom has been a non-factor for the previous 36 episodes now. So why should I care about him now?

From a production standpoint, I get it: Yodom is going to be the big-bad, and the writers are moving the series into its endgame. But shoving Yodom in here shortchanges both plots. We got robbed of an even richer Sena plot (and probably a good Sena/Sayo/Yodonna catfight) and a better build-up for Yodom. Despite Kiramager's successes, the villains have routinely been the weakest aspect of the show. Having the big boss drop in after so long doesn't help with that; sure he's powerful, but he's only important because the plot dictates it, not because of anything he's done. Who lead to Crystallia's fall? Garuza. Who's been hazing the Kiramagers for the last 36 episodes? Garuza, Kurantula, and Yodonna (who despite being Yodom, is clearly her own distinct personality). At no point are we given a reason to care about Yodom, so he's little more than a late-series distraction.

And while we're on the subject of the villains, -1 point for the Kurantula fake-out. Either kill him or don't. Don't kill him in the previous episode and then bring him back in the next one; it greatly cheapens the previous episode. Also, shouldn't he be missing an aspect of his personality now?

Getting back to the positives, here's another episode with some more great mecha footage. It's a bit ridiculous that they're even bringing out Express given that they know that Garuza can hijack it, but I am loving Evil King Express. Overall I don't really get why Kiramager is focusing so much on the mecha now when the show didn't pay them an outsized portion of attention in the first half of the series, but I'll take it. We haven't been treated to this much mecha action - proper suits and all - since Go-Busters almost a decade ago.:D

Finally, kudos to the post-production team on the multiple Senas. The compositing was done very well. There are only a handful of small tells that give away the usage of green screening, and that's around the lighting. Otherwise they nailed things like getting them behind the table without any artifacting.
takenoko wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:56 pm Poor Sayo, wearing shorts in this weather
If it's any consolation prize, aren't these episodes normally filmed about 8 weeks before airing? So it was only late October/early November when they shot that. :o
So in the end, why did Yodom want to meet with Oladdin?
Apparently to gloat? That's one of the problems with this episode; Yodom didn't really do anything. His appearance was more for writing reasons, to setup the series' endgame.
Yodom's real form is kinda unusual, I don't know what to think of it
It looks very inflexible. Which has me a bit worried once it comes time for the obligatory big bad fight.
Phoenix512 wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:57 am If the left mask is the one that has Yodonna, I wonder what the right mask is supposed to be?
That is a really good question! Having two masks like that is too big and obvious of a detail to merely be decorative, so I'm sure we'll get an answer to that question sooner than later.
vasyear wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:41 am HOLY SHIT this got DARK!
If Sayo wasn't there Sena 5 would've committed suicide, this is another reaction to COVID clearly and mad respect for TOEI for putting that subject matter in a kids show,
incredible work by both actresses, the desperation in their eyes, taking of the hair tie (whatever you call them) THAT'S when you knew she WAS going to happen she was going into the sea and nothing could stop her, the hair tie is a big part of Sayo cause it relates to her runner background taking it of was 5's way of saying "I am no longer Sayo" "I’m nothing" I hope this brings Sayo and Sena together and make them better friends
Since there's clearly a bit of disagreement over whether Downer Sena intended to commit suicide at the beach, I believe she was going to take a long walk into the sea in part for the reasons stated above. That entire scene was played very dramatically and straight, with long pauses, conspicuously-selected shots of Sena and the sea, and a purposeful lack of background music. If your character is not going to end it all, then you aren't going to make it look like they are with that level of detail, least you mislead the audience and create a plot inconsistency. But if you are going to have your character end it all, then this would be the traditional, "tactful" way to set the scene without being more explicit.

I should also add that Sena's hostile reaction to Sayo coming to save her is very on-point for actual suicide attempts. She was doing it in private, which typically indicates that she wanted to go through with it (people who do it publicly typically want to be stopped). So a hostile reaction in that situation mirrors real life, where people who are stopped normally resent it at first.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by Lunagel »

I gotta disagree, Sena said before that her backup plan was to be a waitress on Shounan beach if the track thing didn't work out. Narratively speaking, it makes more sense she'd pack up her bags and do that, not off herself.

And I don't see how it connects to Covid even if it was about suicide?
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by WannaFantaMan »

This was a good episode just not as good as it usually is, probably because the whole "five Sena" plot was resolved WAY too quickly. Anyone else think that they'll beat Yodom by using a cluster-fuck mech? Since we only have roughly nine episodes left, it would make the most sense plot wise to have that be the nail in his coffin if they even plan on making another cluster-fuck combo xD
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

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Lunagel wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:35 pm I gotta disagree, Sena said before that her backup plan was to be a waitress on Shounan beach if the track thing didn't work out. Narratively speaking, it makes more sense she'd pack up her bags and do that, not off herself.
But she's not Sena, she's the worst part of Sena. She knew she wasn't wanted; why would she stick around to fail at another job? My reading on that scene was that Sayo (correctly) assumed that since Sena has a thing for the beach, that's where she'd go (and thus why that element was introduced: to give Sayo a hint to follow).

Ultimately, I don't believe going through all that set-up makes sense if she's just going to get another job. You don't do a big, sad scene like that for someone who intends to live.
And I don't see how it connects to Covid even if it was about suicide?
Yeah, I agree with that much. Anything COVID related would be a stretch.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by takenoko »

Yeah, I don't think Sena was killing herself either because kid's show. But there's no doubt in my mind that they pulled from suicide imagery which is why I'm having a strong reaction to it. I don't know if I think it's gross or a tactful way of touching on subjects of depression in a kid's show
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

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takenoko wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:58 pm Yeah, I don't think Sena was killing herself either because kid's show. But there's no doubt in my mind that they pulled from suicide imagery which is why I'm having a strong reaction to it. I don't know if I think it's gross or a tactful way of touching on subjects of depression in a kid's show
That's a fair compromise. As viewers we can't always know exactly what the writers were thinking/intending, and to a large extent it doesn't matter in this specific case since the intended audience means they would never show her actively trying to commit suicide.

But they totally went there with the imagery, which is what surprised me. By western standards, that's a very dark place to go for a program like this. :shock: It was definitely effective, however; it made for a very powerful and memorable scene.

As to whether it's gross or tactful, it may or may not have been tactful, but it does seem to steer clear of being gross. At no point is it played for laughs or downplayed as not being serious. Nor is it used solely for shock value, as badly written dramas sometimes do.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by Thenosa Yechette »

Mandalori wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 9:22 am
So, Juru likes the emotional Sena huh…? Why did she have to hug Juru…? WHY JURU??!!
Actually, it's the other way around. She's the one that hugged him while he was looking uncomfortable.
That is what I said. I said, "Why did she have to hug Juru?". I didn't say "Juru hugged Sena". I did notice that Juru was looking uncomfortable when "she hugged" him.
windfall wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 11:24 am
Thenosa Yechette wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 5:07 am It’s pleasant to see the Evil King Express return. Why didn’t they acknowledge that Tametomo was taken hostage with Mashin Express this time? Is it because he’s a guy?
I think he was in Zabyun and not Express.
No, it was Sena piloting the Zabyuun and not Tametomo. Tametomo must've been piloting the Mashin Express. Sena has mainly been the main pilot of the train mechs throughout the series i.e. the different formations using the Mashin Express and Mashin Zabyuun. She piloted the King Express more than the other Kiramagers(as far as I remember) and she has been the primary pilot of King Express Zabyuun ever since its debut. It's probably because the she is an athlete and her personality goes with the whole fast mechs/train mechs and stuff. And she mainly pilots the King Express Zabyuun also because of the mech's blade/sword weapon and her primary weapon(and sole weapon so far in the season) being the Kiramai Sword.
midorininger wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 12:02 pm my only issue with the episode was the beach. like what was moddy sena about to do? she let her hair down, if she had taken her shoes off i think it would have been darker, but was she going into the ocean to end it all? i only thought that because she ran away from Sayo INTO THE WATER like its still winter! that had to have been cold AF! but there didn't seem to be any point to them being in the water, they could have ran on the nice less cold sand and had the same thing. did they really just want to get the girls wet?
I was confused about that scene too. At first when I saw this episode's preview in the previous episode I also thought that she was going to attempt suicide. But then when I actually watched this episode, I wasn't so sure anymore. It looked a bit like she was about to try to die in the beginning with her dialogues and her removing he hair tie. But she was all dressed up and had a bag which doesn't make it like she was trying to die or something. Then Sayo came and mentioned what Sena said earlier about Sena's backup career plan, which made it feel like Sena wasn't trying to die. And then a few seconds later Sena ran into the sea with Sayo following her, which again made it feel like she was trying to die. I admit, that the scene of Sayo trying to convince Sena to come back is amazing. But from the audience's perspective, it's confusing as to what Sena had intended to do by going to the beach in the first place.
takenoko wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:58 pm Yeah, I don't think Sena was killing herself either because kid's show. But there's no doubt in my mind that they pulled from suicide imagery which is why I'm having a strong reaction to it. I don't know if I think it's gross or a tactful way of touching on subjects of depression in a kid's show
Considering that SS is a kids' show, I didn't think that they would use that dark storyline. But again in Shinkenger, we saw A KID attempting suicide by jumping from a roof in an episode earlier in the season. The kid had made a deal with a monster(I don't exactly remember why the kid was trying to die, but I do remember that he was jumping from a roof and Mako and Ryunosuke saved him but the kid was injured in the process) and tried to die.
I wanna see what happens to Yodonna now that she knows that she is a part of Emperor Yodon. Hope to learn more about her character.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by midorininger »

takenoko wrote: Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:58 pm Yeah, I don't think Sena was killing herself either because kid's show. But there's no doubt in my mind that they pulled from suicide imagery which is why I'm having a strong reaction to it. I don't know if I think it's gross or a tactful way of touching on subjects of depression in a kid's show
not trying to press the suicide thing, but you say "because its a kids show" but last season during Ryusoulger, Ui, when she was the source for the Menosaur almost committed suicide. and i recall Lunagel had a strong reaction to that. anyways, while i dont think Sena was going to take the plunge so to speak, there was indeed a lot of imagery to suggest it. but since she was worst outcomes only sena, maybe she thought she wasnt going to succeed at flipping burgers and you know ... either way she didnt and thats good.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by takenoko »

Yeah, and that was shocking too. If I recall, it felt very sudden and out of the blue for the story, making it very feel gross. If the Sena thing was a more subtler way of tackling the same issue, then this was much better by comparison
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by Thenosa Yechette »

Go-On Macaroni wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 6:15 pm Tl;dr: I thought it was a respectful take on such a situation and one more reason I'm going to miss this show when it ends.
Well, regardless of what that scene exactly was indicating towards, this episode was spectacular in its own way. And yes, even if people try to pick flaws from the first half(first 20 episodes or so) of Kiramger, it was a great season over-all. It definitely was one of the best seasons in the last few years because people dislike Ryusoulger for many reasons, Kyuranger has mixed reviews, Zyuohger is considered average and MOST OF THE PEOPLE (around 95-100% of fans) LOVE Lupin Vs Pat. So, considering the recent seasons mentioned above, Kiramager definitely delivered its sparkle, with enough elements in it that makes it a great season. I am CERTAINLY going to miss it a lot!
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by resop2 »

I wonder if Lupin vs Pat and Kiramager are widely liked because both are built around shoujo manga troupes?
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by Thenosa Yechette »

resop2 wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:28 am I wonder if Lupin vs Pat and Kiramager are widely liked because both are built around shoujo manga troupes?
That's certainly possible. I won't know since I don't read manga. Which parts of the seasons are Shoujo manga tropes?
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

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Thenosa Yechette wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:21 pm So, Juru likes the emotional Sena huh…? Why did she have to hug Juru…? WHY JURU??!!
Mandalori wrote: Fri Jan 01, 2021 9:22 am Actually, it's the other way around. She's the one that hugged him while he was looking uncomfortable.
That is what I said. I said, "Why did she have to hug Juru?". I didn't say "Juru hugged Sena". I did notice that Juru was looking uncomfortable when "she hugged" him.
Actually you did say "So, Juru likes the emotional Sena huh…?".
Last edited by Mandalori on Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by resop2 »

Thenosa Yechette wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 1:23 am
resop2 wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:28 am I wonder if Lupin vs Pat and Kiramager are widely liked because both are built around shoujo manga troupes?
That's certainly possible. I won't know since I don't read manga. Which parts of the seasons are Shoujo manga tropes?
While the trope of the Phantom Thief isn't exclusively shoujo manga, there have been many mainstream anime based on this troupe: Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne, Saint Tail, and Cat's Eye come to mind. In each one, one of the main thieves has a close relationship with one of the police investigating their crimes but the police person is unaware of the thief's real identity. Also, in Cat's Eye, the Kaitou were three sisters who ran a cafe that the police who investigate the crimes frequented.

As for Kiramager, just imagine that Jewel was a girl. (It's not that I think that the actor lacks manliness, but the part has him doing nothing that is exclusively male or female.) If Jewel is a girl, then you have a VERY stereotypical shoujo manga story: Jewel is a introverted shy "everygirl" who sticks to herself in school and enjoys drawing. One day four amazing warriors come and tell her that she is the destined Red Ranger who will save a magical land with the power of her drawings and imagination. The four warriors include a Perfect Japanese Girl (Sayo), a Tom Boy (Sena), a dark haired bishounen (Shigaru), and a blond bishounen (Tametomo). At first, Jewel struggles trying to keep up with these amazing elite people, but they soon accept Jewel as she is because of the strength of her heart.
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Re: Kiramager Episode 37 released

Post by Thenosa Yechette »

Mandalori wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 7:49 am
Thenosa Yechette wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:21 pm So, Juru likes the emotional Sena huh…? Why did she have to hug Juru…? WHY JURU??!!

That is what I said. I said, "Why did she have to hug Juru?". I didn't say "Juru hugged Sena". I did notice that Juru was looking uncomfortable when "she hugged" him.
Actually you did say "So, Juru likes the emotional Sena huh…?".
By "LIKE" I meant that "prefer" and NOT in a "romantic way". When the "emotional" Sena was being emotional and crying in front of Juru, at first he was looking uncomfortable because of the crying and hugging. And after that he realized that this is Sena's emotional side and said something like "I like this part of Sena too." Though this wasn't his exact dialogue, I talked about the interpretation of the dialogue he said which was "This is great too." I wanted to say that he preferred the "emotional" Sena. Cuz in the episode the guys were sorta hanging around different types of Sena after identifying the different parts of her, "as if" they preferred that side of Sena more. For example, after Tametomo identified the "athletic" Sena/Sena 1, his attitude showed that he really likes(I mean prefer and not liking in a "romantic way") that side of Sena and he was seen hanging around her right before Sena 1 & 2 were merged back. Similarly, Shiguru was around Sena 3(capable worker), Takamichi was around Sena 2(cute) and Juru was around Sena 4(emotional Sena). About the possibility of whether Juru actually likes Sena in a romantic way is a different discussion. For now, I meant that he most probably prefers the emotional side of her. I'm sorry if it was misleading. I'll edit this bit from that post.
resop2 wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 9:57 am While the trope of the Phantom Thief isn't exclusively shoujo manga, there have been many mainstream anime based on this troupe: Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne, Saint Tail, and Cat's Eye come to mind. In each one, one of the main thieves has a close relationship with one of the police investigating their crimes but the police person is unaware of the thief's real identity. Also, in Cat's Eye, the Kaitou were three sisters who ran a cafe that the police who investigate the crimes frequented.

As for Kiramager, just imagine that Jewel was a girl. (It's not that I think that the actor lacks manliness, but the part has him doing nothing that is exclusively male or female.) If Jewel is a girl, then you have a VERY stereotypical shoujo manga story: Jewel is a introverted shy "everygirl" who sticks to herself in school and enjoys drawing. One day four amazing warriors come and tell her that she is the destined Red Ranger who will save a magical land with the power of her drawings and imagination. The four warriors include a Perfect Japanese Girl (Sayo), a Tom Boy (Sena), a dark haired bishounen (Shigaru), and a blond bishounen (Tametomo). At first, Jewel struggles trying to keep up with these amazing elite people, but they soon accept Jewel as she is because of the strength of her heart.
I can't tell about Lupin VS Pat. But for Kiramager, I think I understand Juru's character being from shoujo manga. Nonetheless I feel that his character is just a widely used trope over-all. It's interesting and funny in cases. I don't exactly want to call Sena tomboyish or a tomboy. Because in episode 37, we saw that only 2/5th of her is tomboyish; Sena 1 (athletic Sena )and Sena 3 (capable worker), if you want to call Sena 3 tomboyish. The rest of them are cute Sena and emotional Sena both of which are very girly. The last is the pessimist Sena, which is a very gender neutral side. And apart from the very few times when Sena is acting on her athletic side, I think Sena is mostly girly, sensitive and extroverted.
From this point of view, I think Sayo is more tomboyish than Sena. She is sometimes scary, mature, she can just get up and pin someone to the ground in a flash, she has a humorous side to her, she knows Aikido. All of these makes her more tomboyish than Sena imo.
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