Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

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MaxHazard
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by MaxHazard »

the first appearance of VIce during Young Ikki seems to be nice, willing to help Ikki to save his family + wipe the memory for fire incident, but how come Vice wanna eat Ikki's Mother in the first episode?
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by takenoko »

MaxHazard wrote: Wed Mar 09, 2022 5:20 am the first appearance of VIce during Young Ikki seems to be nice, willing to help Ikki to save his family + wipe the memory for fire incident, but how come Vice wanna eat Ikki's Mother in the first episode?
It's the redemption of Vice. They probably realized Vice as a character wasn't working at the beginning, so they made him a bit less manic, gave him some grounding and some actual bonding with Ikki, and now the backstory makes it seem like he was a good guy all along. Either they knew all along that they would go this way (possible with this series, jeez), or they hadn't planned for Vice to be as offputting as he was at the beginning, so they changed it
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by SVNBob »

takenoko wrote: Sun Mar 06, 2022 1:50 am [Who did KR Vail fight against when he was a Kamen Rider?
Not sure. But what's more interesting to me is the timeline.

Vail was supposed to have been created and active as a Rider between 25-30 years ago, right? That puts him before Kuuga, and pretty close to, but likely after, Shin, ZO, and J.

The time when there was no Rider.

Now there's a "forgotten" one from that time that doesn't contradict "established canon".


That is a plot point worthy of a major anniversary series.
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by Ashki »

While overall I loved the episode, I feel like they crammed too much together and sacrificed a lot of substance as a result. We literally went from "Fire? There was a fire?" to exposition central in the course of one episode. It would've been far better had the whole fire subplot been dragged out over a couple episodes with Ikki getting weird flashes and PTSD symptoms every time they happen. Let him freak out in a battle as well, as an explosion triggers the PTSD symptoms. Finally, have George REMEMBER a story his dad once told him that he'd completely forgotten.

Not only would this have added some serious believability to Ikki forgetting the incident for 18 years (as suppresed memories are common in PTSD, and Vice could have suppresed the memory to protect Ikki from himself during that moment, i.e. it was all a bad dream that fades away in the morning). Also, Vice was wearing his mask 18 years ago? They REALLY better explain the whole mask thing by the end of this! Honestly, while the fire thing could've been a really cool revelation, it just fell flat because of how they crammed it in and didn't bother making it fit what we know.

What really sucked about this was that you have one battle with Veil and suddenly Ikki just remembers everything and George somehow also suddenly remembers a highly detailed "story" his dad once told him that he obviously had no clue about at the beginning of the episode.

takenoko wrote: Mon Mar 07, 2022 9:39 am >So Buu-san is dad's confidant? That's why he always says that he can't say anything...

This is the weird contradiction that is Vice. The crazy mile-long vision this show has, but used to poor effect. We see Buu-san from episode 1, but they don't give him a character or personality or interesting things that are memorable to do before this point
The only excuse I can think of is that he was involved in the Rider project and remained with the family to keep an eye on Genta. It's also very odd how nonchalant the mother is about his "heart pains".
takenoko wrote: I mean, bad guys can care about 1-2 people in their group. Aguilera was all about people sacrificing themselves to Giff up until she got put on the chopping block

>To fulfill their super selfish and evil desires.... ?

Hmm, not sure Aguilera was being selfish or evil here. Or the cult followers. Or Pat-3 either?
I never had the impression Aguilera was evil. We learn pretty early on that she was told at a young age that she would be Gifu's bride. For young girls especially, it's like a faerie tale, where she's promised to some great prince and is therefore a princess bride. While she was in charge of the Deadmans, she could be cold towards regular humans, but she seemed to take care of the Deadmans themselves. BUt we also know from her talks with Tamaki that something happened to her growing up that made her turn away from being human, which is also why she personally took Julio in.

The difference between her and Olteca is pretty severe. She never harmed the Deadmans, and her entire purpose in life revolved around marrying Gifu. She never deceived her minions, and always let them choose their path knowing what that entailed. Compare that to Olteca, who has been lying and manipulating from the beginning. He planned to sacrifice her, rather than help her become Gifu's bride. That betrayal and the fact that she'd been manipulated, likely from the start, made her rethink a lot of things. On top of that, the obvious chemistry between her and Sakura suggests she may see something in the latter that she's lost in herself.

I wasn't surprised to see Aguilera upset that Olteca had basically brainwashed people into killing themselves for his own amusement. It goes against everything she stood for when she led the Deadmans and she's not aware that Olteca's resurrecting Gifu in this manner, only that he's using people who came to them for shelter. I'll be shocked if she doesn't change sides officially very soon - IF Olteca doesn't use the Gifu stamp to get rid of her first, that is.
SVNBob wrote: Wed Mar 09, 2022 10:52 am Not sure. But what's more interesting to me is the timeline.
Vail was supposed to have been created and active as a Rider between 25-30 years ago, right? That puts him before Kuuga, and pretty close to, but likely after, Shin, ZO, and J.
The time when there was no Rider.
Now there's a "forgotten" one from that time that doesn't contradict "established canon".

That is a plot point worthy of a major anniversary series.
It would be fascinating if this really does tie back into the Lost Era. I mean, we've had prototype Riders before (Drive had an entire war everyone conveniently forgot about, for example), but we do still have a continuity question to deal with. All of the Showa-era shows, from KR to Black RX all happened in the same universe and most of them were tied together by the Tachibana Rider Club and various incarnations of Shocker that were all identified as being part of the same organisation. Kuuga and Agito happened in the same universe as well, with one being a sequel to the other. But all other series, including the movie era, were in their own universes. Even Decade happened in its own universe and didn't actually share a universe with the shows that came before it (much like Zenkaiger, the universe simply had other worlds that contained alternate versions of the previous Riders/Sentai).

All that said, KR Veil existed during the Lost Era, but doesn't actually fill any continuity gaps because Showa and Kuuga/Agito happened in different timelines to begin with. Now, it's entirely possible they could tie this show in with Showa by revealing that Daddy was working for Shocker and the stamps were developed only after the whole Shadow Moon thing. They could then have Veil being beaten by the Showa Riders, which resulted in the demon being trapped in a Driver for 18 years. It could explain George's obsesssion with previous Riders (and especially the Showa ones). That would also help fix the little continuity issue of Veil being defeated during KR Blade (makes you wonder - IF they wanted to tie things together, could Gifu have actually been one of the Undead? Especially if you decide to bring in the Major Arcana with Joker doubling as The Fool).

Sadly, Veil's history will probably never get fleshed out or tied into previous series, as is TOEI's habit with prototype Riders thus far. It would make for a great manga series, though.
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by Thenosa Yechette »

Ashki wrote: Wed Mar 09, 2022 6:54 pm Sadly, Veil's history will probably never get fleshed out or tied into previous series, as is TOEI's habit with prototype Riders thus far. It would make for a great manga series, though.
I don't that's the case here. As far as I know, KR Vail is getting a TTFC spin-off series.... So we will probably see and know more about him in that series I guess.
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by Connie_Edogawa »

just a heads up, you linked this on the front page as the episode 26 discussion thread.
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Re: Kamen Rider Revice 25 Discussion thread

Post by takenoko »

Whoops. Thank you!
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