KR Den-O 48 released

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Starscream
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Starscream »

Spoiler
take, are you sure that Sakurai's using the Zeronos card would erase Ryoutarou's memory? It seems odd that the cards would affect Ryoutarou only for a particular instant, but would completely erase the memory of Sakurai from anyone else. I suppose it COULD be the effect of his being a Singularity Point, but I took Airi's comments to mean that HER memories would be erased, and Ryoutarou had to somehow force himself to forget about the baby.


At any rate, holy hell. What a GREAT episode, and it seems that things are FINALLY falling into place. A lot of lingering questions being answered, the heartbreaking betrayal of Urataros, and, of course, the obligatory pending destruction of the universe by the big bad guy. It's really remarkable to take note of everyone's growth throughout the series; Ryuutaros especially was surprising in how much he's grown to care for his DenLiner family.

Of course, the episode couldn't be TOO serious, and so we have the ever-eccentric Time Lords Owner and Stationmaster still with their seemingly silly game of "Who knocks over the flag in the rice" contest, which of course will pan out to be rather symbolic at the end of it all.

EDIT: The first part of this comment referred to Take's now-deleted first post, so I'm spoilering it away just in case.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by WhiteAsh »

Starscream wrote:
Spoiler
take, are you sure that Sakurai's using the Zeronos card would erase Ryoutarou's memory? It seems odd that the cards would affect Ryoutarou only for a particular instant, but would completely erase the memory of Sakurai from anyone else. I suppose it COULD be the effect of his being a Singularity Point, but I took Airi's comments to mean that HER memories would be erased, and Ryoutarou had to somehow force himself to forget about the baby.


At any rate, holy hell. What a GREAT episode, and it seems that things are FINALLY falling into place. A lot of lingering questions being answered, the heartbreaking betrayal of Urataros, and, of course, the obligatory pending destruction of the universe by the big bad guy. It's really remarkable to take note of everyone's growth throughout the series; Ryuutaros especially was surprising in how much he's grown to care for his DenLiner family.

Of course, the episode couldn't be TOO serious, and so we have the ever-eccentric Time Lords Owner and Stationmaster still with their seemingly silly game of "Who knocks over the flag in the rice" contest, which of course will pan out to be rather symbolic at the end of it all.

EDIT: The first part of this comment referred to Take's now-deleted first post, so I'm spoilering it away just in case.
Why not just delete that part? O.o Also, I cried when I saw Ryuuta crying for Ura and Kin. URa was like the motherly one, whereas Kin was that wacky uncle who fell asleep in weird places. Haaa...
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by KamenRider2000 »

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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by WhiteAsh »

KamenRider2000 wrote:
WhiteAsh wrote:
Why not just delete that part? O.o Also, I cried when I saw Ryuuta crying for Ura and Kin. URa was like the motherly one, whereas Kin was that wacky uncle who fell asleep in weird places. Haaa...
scary...i can't imagine Ura being a mother..O_O
Motherly. Motherly. If you compare him to the other imagin surrounding Ryuuta, he's the most effeminate one. He also speaks the most politely, despite his being a liar.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by +Kardboard+ »

One bit I really liked was the part where future Ryo meets past Ryo and we see how much he's grown and matured....and lost the tendency to faint all of a sudden...hahaha
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by takenoko »

Probably that too, but since they were talking about Ryoutarou forgetting, I thought they were talking about him in particular.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Warrior of Zarona »

Wow. The series and plot seems quite brilliant. So let's take a look at it so far.
Spoiler
Time is paved by people's memories. Memories itself are time.

Because singular points aren't affected by changes in time, their memories are essential in restoring any damages through time itself. I feel like they are protectors of time. Because of this, any memory the Ryoutarou of that time may have fixes most of the damage done by the Imagin.

Then we also have Zeronos, the cards, and ZeroLiner. Owner once said that the bearer of Zeronos and ZeroLiner is in position of protecting time. We also know that Zeronos doesn't have to be a singular point, and Sakurai Yuuto isn't one, but in order to use its powers, the memories of his existence is slowly deteriorated. The green cards erase the older Sakurai-san while the new red cards erase Yuuto. However, Zeronos cards also prevent its user from disappearing in time should any changes in the past affect them, such as their younger selves being killed off, thanks to the actions Zeronos contributed to restoring time being saved. This is the reason why Yuuto obviously came back with the premiere of Zero Form, and possibly why the older Sakurai also returns each time he is erased from time. Zeronos cards can also affect the memories of singular points - to what extent is unknown. For the cards to be able to affect even a singular point's memory makes it a very powerful item. It feels like Zeronos is not only a protector of time himself, but a fail-safe device for singular points for the sake of protecting time itself. Because of the price he has to pay to use the cards, Zeronos is a being destined to live his life alone.

With that point made, it seems like the Zeronos cards were used to erase Airi's memories as well as affecting Ryoutarou's partially by forgetting about his sister's future child. It's suggested that a timeline existed prior to this event - the timeline where Hana came from.

My theory:

ZeroLiner didn't disappear from Hana's time. Rather, it went back in time before Hana was born and arrived at Hope Hill sometime when Airi and Sakurai were watching the stars, as described in Airi's flashback. It must have been at this point that they were told of the future and what must be done to protect it. However, the changes that Sakurai and Airi made created a new timeline where Hana didn't exist.

Thinking of it this way - it wasn't really the Imagin who destroyed the timeline; in actuality, because they were trying to protect the baby by erasing her from time, her future was erased as a result, and she was unaffected by those changes.

Airi said that if they didn't protect the baby, the Imagin would continue to attack. As this wasn't enough to stop the Imagin from rampaging and reconnecting their time to the past and the present, I suppose Hana found her way to DenLiner and, making a contract with the Owner, set back in time to 2007 to find a singular point who can become Den-O and help defeat the Imagin.

I'm also quite curious about Kai. He's a singular point, and yet his memories seem to be really unstable. Could it be a result of all the Imagin he's controlling? Could the Zeronos cards have something to do with it as well? I suppose we'll find out in the last episode.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by lotr195 »

I think that hana is the baby because when they went back into the time where sakurai did not exist ari was obsesed with flowers or hana.
the writers seem really good and i cannot wait for the next episode!
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by GcnMaster »

lotr195 wrote:I think that hana is the baby because when they went back into the time where sakurai did not exist ari was obsesed with flowers or hana.
the writers seem really good and i cannot wait for the next episode!
This is already debunked by the episode itself. :/ Firstly, the time Ryou-tachi went to was one with Sakurai's existence, the cafe was the Milk Dipper, and looked normal.

Secondly, if Sakurai never existed, there wouldn't be a baby.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Skinwalker »

So...

Spoiler
Sakurai and Airi were at the lake when Zeronos appeared to get him to fight the imagin... Then he made a contract with Deneb to have Deneb fight alongside his past self... The cards use up people's memories of him... Making Airi forget about what happened... And now they made Ryoutarou forget about the baby, which erased the baby's existence?

<_<
And older ('present') Sakurai (with the hat) is just there to make sure Den-O/ Zeronos are fighting on time or something? >_>

And the imagins' time (a possible future) is disappearing like they made Hana's do, so Kai wants to connect it to the present?

And Airi is the key to doing that but not the key, so the key is probably her baby or something?


>_<
my head hurts
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Warrior of Zarona »

Skinwalker wrote:So...

Spoiler
Sakurai and Airi were at the lake when Zeronos appeared to get him to fight the imagin... Then he made a contract with Deneb to have Deneb fight alongside his past self... The cards use up people's memories of him... Making Airi forget about what happened... And now they made Ryoutarou forget about the baby, which erased the baby's existence?

<_<
And older ('present') Sakurai (with the hat) is just there to make sure Den-O/ Zeronos are fighting on time or something? >_>

And the imagins' time (a possible future) is disappearing like they made Hana's do, so Kai wants to connect it to the present?

And Airi is the key to doing that but not the key, so the key is probably her baby or something?


>_<
my head hurts
Spoiler
The scene at the lake, Sakurai had already become Zeronos at this point - they're not separate entities. Sakurai and Airi made contact with ZeroLiner before this time.

The older Sakurai isn't just there to make sure they're fighting on time. He's in the past in every single event the Imagin fly to because the Imagin's initial mission was to chase after and kill Sakurai when they thought he was the junction point key. Truthfully told, Kai tries to locate Sakurai on specific dates and find people who have memories on these dates to fly to the past and go after him. Deneb decides to help Sakurai, who makes a contract with him to go back and help his younger version, bringing along the Zeronos gear. The reason for this isn't very clear, but I suppose it has to do with Sakurai-san being a lure for the Imagin, and it'd be easier for his younger self to assist him from the outside as Zeronos.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Luna »

Great episode. Too bad Owner is missing out on the action. Strangely enough Den-O didn't break apart like Blade did. Kamen Rider Blade kinda got off into "oh my fucking god it's the end of the worldz!" and Den-O stayed close to the same pace. Uratoros was cool too. He sounded "closer" to Shadow than he usually did (He is Shadow the Hedgehog's voice actor too, but then I'm not too much into Sonic anyways). As I've learned from the Kamen Rider series, someone HAS to disappear.
So who would it be? I'd guess maybe Ryoutarou because he's Den-O and the "main" rider, but maybe something will be there for ohers to remember him. I probably wouldn't know anyways.

Thanks TV-Nihon for Den-O! I'm looking forward to the movie and last episode!
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by Honoo »

Someone has to disappear... I think the Taros (quite obvious, I know) and probably Zeronos. But time can be restored so they will be only temporary disappearance.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by antiemo19 »

Skinwalker wrote:So...

Spoiler
Sakurai and Airi were at the lake when Zeronos appeared to get him to fight the imagin... Then he made a contract with Deneb to have Deneb fight alongside his past self... The cards use up people's memories of him... Making Airi forget about what happened... And now they made Ryoutarou forget about the baby, which erased the baby's existence?

<_<
And older ('present') Sakurai (with the hat) is just there to make sure Den-O/ Zeronos are fighting on time or something? >_>

And the imagins' time (a possible future) is disappearing like they made Hana's do, so Kai wants to connect it to the present?

And Airi is the key to doing that but not the key, so the key is probably her baby or something?


>_<
my head hurts
I think I just got Kai's back story and some extra ramblings.
Spoiler
My theory is Kai is the imagin's fail safe. They find a random singularity point to lead the imagin. Becuase of his existence and memories he can cancel out the fact that the imagin's have no past since peoples memories are the past. Since he is using his super powers to send imagin to any time as he did with in 46 he is dieing in that time. But being a singularity point he is just losing that memory. He also loses his memory each time he tries at the time pulse as imagins flow through that. So basically he is the temporary middleman. He is getting used till he has no past or memories or people remembering him. This means as his memories detoriate so do the imagin and there time. You might think that means don't use Kai, but he is the only way with the singularity points canceling out the imagin time aswell as the only way to organize an attack since by itself the imagin can only randomlly guess there out point. So as long as the junction point and singularity point [Ryoutarou and Hana] exist the imagin time can't exist. If he can kill or use Hana the imagin have there time back. Sure Ryoutarou is still there but if he wasn't a rider he would be very little threat and would not cancel it out. The reason the imagin need humans is without there own time they need to take the time from humans to become corpreal. Remember humans memories are time. Yet at the same time if humans don't exist there is no human time meaning the the imagin time takes place. Hence ryoutaros importance by becoming a rider he is the only one that can stop then repair damage.[Sure the Yuuto aswell but they aren't singularity points meaning they can't help repair to the same effect expcially with the zero cards effects.] The reason the new line is coming intoexistence is Hana remembers and that is bringing back her time making Kai rush further. But back on point Kai is being used until the imagin time is real and the imagins memories have enough signfagance to keep it that way. So that explains the leo imagin that died in 46 it defended Kai as well as stop him from dieing and also checked Kai's memories status and be a limiter as far as Kai's power usage. Hence why Kai went crazy and spawned so many imagin towards the end of 46.[Its actualy just like Marik for all you that remember the battle city ark of Yugioh] Another minor point is that becuase Ryoutarou is a singularity point he can control imagin and if you think about it until the creation of Denkamen the den-o gear really was useless with only platform. This explains why the rider systems are balanced The den gear is useless without coporative imagin to help and the Zero gear is usefull but the sacrfice means all it can do is defeat imagin not repair time. Ryoutaros reliance on imagin and ablity to take the job lighter becuase of ability to repair time was what made Past Yuuto reluctant on first meetings besides being antisocial in general since yuuto had to sacrifice so much to fight and could only do so little in comparison. I'm also sure that there was some planned attachment or power supply for the den and zero systems because of the buttons, armor, and gasher forms for the den system and the vega side and armor of the the zero cards. These attachments just weren't made because of constraints or were destroyed by Kai and the Imagin. For all the questions I might have answered I'm sure I raised more so srry if you are more confused.
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Re: KR Den-O 48 released

Post by WhiteAsh »

Honoo wrote:Someone has to disappear... I think the Taros (quite obvious, I know) and probably Zeronos. But time can be restored so they will be only temporary disappearance.
Imagin don't get restored by time repair, incase you hadn't remembered the rest of the series.
From Beginning to End... Den-O is at a CLIMAX!
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